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Sunday, 13 Aug 2006
Samir Kuntar, in case you didn't know, is the main guy that Hezbollah kidnapped the 2 israeli soldiers to get back. This is how Hezbollah sees it:
Lebanese
media refer to Kuntar as the "dean" of Lebanese prisoners in Israel. He
has been in prison for 28 years, and Hizballah wants him out.Although
Kuntar was jailed for an attack launched by a Lebanon-based Palestinian
terrorist group before Hizballah was even established, Hizballah
depicts itself as the vanguard of the Islamic campaign against Israel
and regards winning freedom for the prisoners a "sacred duty."
What was he jailed for exactly?
In
the coastal town of Nahariya, the terrorists shot dead a policeman and
forced their way into an apartment building, where they captured Danny
Haran and his daughter, Einat, 4.While the terrorists rampaged
through the apartment, firing weapons and detonating grenades, Haran's
wife Smadar hid in a crawlspace above the couple's bedroom together
with their other daughter, two-year-old Yael, and a neighbor.In
an effort to prevent Yael from crying out and alerting the terrorists
to their whereabouts, Smadar kept her hand over the child's mouth, and
accidentally smothered her to death.Meanwhile Kuntar and his group took Danny and Einat Haran to the beach.
"There,
according to eyewitnesses, one of them shot Danny in front of Einat so
that his death would be the last sight she would ever see," Smadar
wrote later."Then he smashed my little girl's skull in against a rock with his rifle butt. That terrorist was Samir Kuntar."
Or you could read the account left by the only member of that family left, Danny's wife:
It had been a peaceful Sabbath day. My husband,
Danny, and I had picnicked with our little girls, Einat, 4, and Yael,
2, on the beach not far from our home in Nahariya, a city on the
northern coast of Israel, about six miles south of the Lebanese border.
Around midnight, we were asleep in our apartment when four terrorists,
sent by Abu Abbas from Lebanon, landed in a rubber boat on the beach
two blocks away. Gunfire and exploding grenades awakened us as the
terrorists burst into our building. They had already killed a police
officer. As they charged up to the floor above ours, I opened the door
to our apartment. In the moment before the hall light went off, they
turned and saw me. As they moved on, our neighbor from the upper floor
came running down the stairs. I grabbed her and pushed her inside our
apartment and slammed the door.Outside, we could hear the men storming about.
Desperately, we sought to hide. Danny helped our neighbor climb into a
crawl space above our bedroom; I went in behind her with Yael in my
arms. Then Danny grabbed Einat and was dashing out the front door to
take refuge in an underground shelter when the terrorists came crashing
into our flat. They held Danny and Einat while they searched for me and
Yael, knowing there were more people in the apartment. I will never
forget the joy and the hatred in their voices as they swaggered about
hunting for us, firing their guns and throwing grenades. I knew that if
Yael cried out, the terrorists would toss a grenade into the crawl
space and we would be killed. So I kept my hand over her mouth, hoping
she could breathe. As I lay there, I remembered my mother telling me
how she had hidden from the Nazis during the Holocaust. "This is just
like what happened to my mother," I thought.As police began to arrive, the terrorists took Danny
and Einat down to the beach. There, according to eyewitnesses, one of
them shot Danny in front of Einat so that his death would be the last
sight she would ever see. Then he smashed my little girl's skull in
against a rock with his rifle butt. That terrorist was Samir Kuntar.By the time we were rescued from the crawl space,
hours later, Yael, too, was dead. In trying to save all our lives, I
had smothered her.The next day, Abu Abbas announced from Beirut that the terrorist attack
in Nahariya had been carried out "to protest the signing of the
Egyptian-Israeli peace treaty" at Camp David the previous year.
This is the guy that Hezbollah did all of this for. And you know what sucks? He will get out, because Olmert now will negotiate to get the 2 prisoners back, which Hezbollah will release only in exchange for Kuntar. This guy, this child-killer will walk free and will be greeted as a Hero when he goes back to Lebanon.
Lebanese people who support Hezbollah, I hope he is worth it!
August 13th, 2006 at 11:06 pm
Hmmm. I have 3 practically simultanious reactions.
Rational: Olmert should be pretty worried about public opinion in Israel right now. I don’t for a moment think they would let him get away with releasing that monster. He has to know this. I don’t think it will happen.
Vindictive: If they do release him, beforehand they should secretly infect him with AIDS or something equally horrible. Syphilis, perhaps.
Zen: No matter what happens, he can’t live forever. In jail or as a free man, death will find him. And when it does, I’m sure god (or whomever) will have interesting plans for him.
August 13th, 2006 at 11:17 pm
A quick search on Samir Kuntar came up with the following:-
http://www.samirkuntar.org/files/About_Samir_Kuntar.htm
So between SM Israeli side of the story and this bio, we can conclude something in-between maybe?
August 13th, 2006 at 11:28 pm
Samir Kuntar dot org? lol
August 13th, 2006 at 11:40 pm
Twosret’s response–given 2 versions, “we can conclude something in between maybe” illustrates the unfortunate trend we Westerners have taken in the past generation. To Twosret, It simply can’t be the case that SM is telling the truth, because someone else has a different “narrative” (as they say). Truth doesn’t mean what it used to. Oprah can pronounce a book as “true,” even after the author himself admits he made things up, and to placate the Palestinians, France can record “Jerusalem” as Arafat’s true birthplace (on his death certificate) even though his birth had been duly recorded in Egypt at the time he was born.
In traditional, premodern cultures, “truth” can contradict fact. We are slipping into that mindset.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:00 am
The Historian,
So much of distrust of truth and facts between both sides that one has to dig more into what he is told.
Same happened with Golda Meir (the Israeli beast) when she claimed that “there are no Palestinians” never mind the FACT is there were 700,000 of them.
Oh well!
August 14th, 2006 at 12:11 am
Ariya,
Yes Menahem Begin the biggest terrorist does have a site doesn’t he? So why not Kuntar
and they are both .org lol
August 14th, 2006 at 12:52 am
A quote that’s always resonated with me:
“For a brief time I served in a small parish in England, and every Sunday after mass, I would see a young boy waiting at the back of the church. And then one day the boy confessed to me that he had beaten his dog to death with a shovel. He said the dog had bitten his baby sister on the cheek and he needed to protect her. And he wanted to know whether he would go to hell for this. I told him that god would understand, that he would be forgiven, as long as he was sorry. But the boy did not care about forgiveness. He was only afraid that if he did go to hell, that dog would be there waiting for him.”
August 14th, 2006 at 12:53 am
A bit of news:
Lebanon falters over truce detail
I would check the other news services, the BBC is biased against the west and anything good about it.
It’s Arab owned you know.
Papa Ray
West Texas
USA
August 14th, 2006 at 12:54 am
Poor old innocent Samir Kuntar.
I suppose Twos thinks the Israelis have been paying taxes to keep his ass alive and in their prisons for the past 28 years just to “stick it” to the Lebanese. Yup.
Also,
9/11 was concocted by Bush himself to go to war with Islam
Osama Bin Laden doesn’t really exist (but is still an Arab hero)
The latest “liquids” plot just uncovered in Britain was a Bush political strategy
Egyptair was shot down off the Coast of the US - it didn’t go down because a pilot lost his mind because (we all know) Egyptians don’t commit suicide because they are Muslims and Muslims don’t do that.
No….that last one was probably true. Muslims usually wait for their governments to kill them or countrymen from another. Usually the wait is not that long. It’s okay though, at least they get to be shoohede.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:54 am
My god… twosret you have no shame. Kuntar is a child murderer and you try to dissimulate? I thought you were a parent.
Kuntar "was tried and convicted for the murders of Danny and Einat Haran. He has also admitted his complicity many times and expressed pride about the killings. Still, he has many supporters in Lebanon who maintain that he is innocent. These supporters also, alternately, claim that the Harans were legitimate targets and considers Kuntar to be a political prisoner."
A political prisoner. Einat Haran, a 9 year old little defenseless child watched her father slain in front of her by Kuntar. Then he smashed her head in.
And he bragged about it.
Perhaps Tali Hatuel, a pregnant mother of 4, with her 4 little kids in a car were also "legitimate targets"? What about these kids? Who were killed by "palis"?
There is far more than this. Just a sample of what your "blameless" bretheren do to children. Happily.
You disgust me Twosret.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:11 am
Enough of this blather!!!! WTF kind of name is “SandMonkey anyways already?” Fer Christs sake, its got two capitals! Let it be known: Henceforth your name is ….
Essmo
!!!
August 14th, 2006 at 1:56 am
On the “bright” side. Now they can assasinate him.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:57 am
It is obvious Kuntar committed this terrible crime, and he should not be released. The captured Israeli soldiers should be released unconditionally; Israel should demand it and the international community and UN that created the UN resolution should support their return. Hezbollah says that it treats prisioners well. . . ok, let’s see these IDF troops returned in good shape.
Ah, Hezbollah still has a lot of missles!!! Do you think that they will disarm and leave Lebanon? What a mess!
SandMonkey, your site is one of my very favorites. Best regards from Texas, lynne
August 14th, 2006 at 2:10 am
Samir Kuntar operation was targeting an Israeli nuclear scientist.
I would call it a pre emptive strike, just like what Israel did to Iraq. The only difference is the means.
As for the dead child, well as Israeli generally refer to Lebanese casualties, her death was the result of collateral damage.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:18 am
They should release the guy, but first they need to put a GPS tracking tag under his skin like a mangy fucking dog while having him sedated so he doesn’t realize what has occurred.
Then, as soon as they release him and get their two soldiers back, they can track him and a helicopter gunship can finish him off.
2 freed Israeli soldiers + 1 dead terrorist. Sounds like a bargain.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:19 am
“was the result of collateral damage.”
Aww..more moral equivocation from the left. The left never seems to understand the difference between intentional and unintentional killings - it is a concept too subtle for the Marxist mind.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:20 am
Excellent satire, Stan. You’ve brilliantly captured the mindset of someone twisted enough to rationalize cold-blooded murder. Brava!
August 14th, 2006 at 2:22 am
Kranky,
Where did I say that I defend him? I merely posted what I found about him. I never voiced my opinion. I posted his side of the story, I didn’t hear of him until SM posted his topic, his site says the story different, I didn’t see him posting anything related to any child killings, on the other hand the mother admitted that she put her hand on her child mouth and she died on the hands of her mother. The rest of the story of the mother wasn’t clear to me that is why I did google to find other sources.
Now in any case my point of view is, no innocent should be dragged into military fights, that is exactly why I oppose war on Lebanon and the innocent being killed. I’m examining both sides of the stories.
Now http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page is a site that can be edited.
Usually I ignore trolls like you but for this statement of yours “If you were here in the US then maybe we could get the CPS folks to protect your offspring from you.”
Your slander statement about my family and children and your threats I will not take lightly. I caution you to be very careful and not address me again.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:33 am
“As for the dead child, well as Israeli generally refer to Lebanese casualties, her death was the result of collateral damage.”
If we are against Israel for it’s wrong doings of killing innocent children and womenin Palestine and Lebanon, then we should not justify killing another innocent on the hand of military/resistance group.
People who usually suffer from injustice should never do the same. That is why I can never comprehend how can Israelis claim suffering from nazi camps when Palestinians are living under the same conditions.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:35 am
“I suppose Twos thinks the”
Were you talking to me anonon?
August 14th, 2006 at 2:41 am
Oooh, Kranky! You have been CAUTIONED! Tworset takes this not LIGHTLy!
Shiver!
Ya’Allah, Tworset! You give Muslims and Middle Easterners a bad name Your attitude precisely reflects why the region is going down the crapper.
There was not one Jew I spoke to when baruch Goldstein massacred the Arabs in the mosque in 1994 who did not say it was foul and disgusting. Not one! There was no equivocation. There was no, “Sure we condemn targeting civillians, BUT you have to understand…” There was no tit-for-tat moral calculations of which civillians it’s ok to murder INTENTIONALLY. Nothing! Just condemnation. Unequivocal.
Sure, I could have found some nutter Jewish right wingers or fundamentalists, but they are not usual, and I wouldn’t normally come into contact with them…
AND THAT IS THE POINT…
YOU, Tworset, are supposedly part of Islam’s and the Middle East’s moderate camp. I can’t picture you as mujahib - you present yourself as “modern.” So while “modern” Jews are able to condemn WITHOUT EQUIVOCATION bestial acts, why the hell can’t you? Why look for the revisionist history of this foul man?
So much of what is fucked up in the Middle East is due to matters of the people unable to make self criticism or to criticise a “brother,” when an “outsider” is involved, no matter how repulsively the brother acts. This is tribalism, not reasoned thinking.
If we want modern, free states in the middle east, we cannot use tribalism as the default moral compass.
As or moral equivalence morons like Stan. Jesus Christ. I hope they don’t live in the West, because as far as I know, every single western penal code distinguishes between crimes on the basis of intent. It’s the difference between manslaughter and murder, murder and self defence, etc. So I just see all these moral equivalence types ringing their hands just as much for the man shot to death by the woman he was raping as they would for the child killed by abusive parents. No moral distinction is necessary. How do such stupid people even work out how to turn on the computer?
August 14th, 2006 at 2:51 am
Lala,
“YOU, Tworset, are supposedly part of Islam’s and the Middle East’s moderate camp. I can’t picture you as mujahib - you present yourself as “modern.” So while “modern” Jews are able to condemn WITHOUT EQUIVOCATION bestial acts, why the hell can’t you? Why look for the revisionist history of this foul man?”
1- When you learn to shoot the message not the messenger you can be considered a mature adult above the age of 18 that is cable of conversing.
2- You are so wrong about many things but this one is a masterpiece. It only shows your ignorance and racism without me even replying with one word.
3- I always check after SM references because it has been clear that he posts some or many views biased to Israel.
4- Everyone has the right to practice critical thinking and dig into facts and history and information so for you to utter your nonsense is another proof of who you are.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:01 am
“Why look for the revisionist history of this foul man?””
I look it up because I want to learn all sides of the story and what happened in an attempt to use my mind unlike you, jump on the internet and shout at people who might differ or try to look up other sources. So reading about Hitler is a crime these days? checking out the history of the holocaust is a crime?
So many people wrote about Hitler should we call 1-800- police for them and threaten them to take their children away from them because Hitler killed many children.
Everyday people write in the News about Olmert, Bibi, Sharon (at a veggie state in the hospital) and their crimes against humanity. Should we shoot them.
You must come from an oppressed background for sure.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:07 am
“Ya’Allah, Tworset! You give Muslims and Middle Easterners a bad name Your attitude precisely reflects why the region is going down the crapper.”
Really? how so? please explain further as you didn’t impress me yet.
“So much of what is fucked up in the Middle East is due to matters of the people unable to make self criticism or to criticise a “brother,” when an “outsider” is involved, no matter how repulsively the brother acts. This is tribalism, not reasoned thinking.”
M.E. hmmmm your ignorance still impress me NOT. Brothers? huh?! tribalism? who?
“How do such stupid people even work out how to turn on the computer?”
if you can do it I can do it.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:09 am
Huh?
Cut down on the coffee ya-okhti. You’ll pop a vessel.
“1- When you learn to shoot the message not the messenger you can be considered a mature adult above the age of 18 that is cable of conversing.”
Yeah yeah.. capable of conversing… above age of 18… Very stern, my good lady. Also, nice use of utterly irrelevant cliche. How are you the messenger (or Messenger (PBUH))?! You post on a message board. You post opinions that seek to justify the murder of innocents. That’s a message that I would love to “shoot,” should this message ever be made corporeal - or am I missing a deeper point?
“2- You are so wrong about many things but this one is a masterpiece. It only shows your ignorance and racism without me even replying with one word.”
What am I wrong about? Are you not modern? Are you indeed hijabi? If so, I apologise. On the blogs, this is not how you come across. You come across as a bit of a fractured soul.
As for accusations of racism - genius!!!
Cry racism when you have no argument!!!
But, my dear lady… if there were such a thing as race, which any good ethnographer, ethnogeneticist, anthropologist, biologist,etc will tell you there is not, then… wait for it… WE ARE OF THE SAME RACE. Try same religion or ethicity. We’re that as well, dear sister. How idiotic!
“3- I always check after SM references because it has been clear that he posts some or many views biased to Israel.”
You went to the Myspace Page of the terrorist himself!
Name: Samir
Music: Fairuz
Films: Anything with Mel Gibson
Passions: bashing mini-Zionists in the head after forcing them to watch their fathers’ executions.
“4- Everyone has the right to practice critical thinking and dig into facts and history and information so for you to utter your nonsense is another proof of who you are.”
Critical thinking? Is that what the kids a calling it these days? Here’s an exercise: What is the Arab/Muslim world suffering from that can not be blamed on US or Israel?
Digging into facts and history? I assume you are not academically trained if by facts and history you mean samirkuntarishotstuff.myspace.com.
Proof of who I am?
?
Go on…
August 14th, 2006 at 3:09 am
“Sure, I could have found some nutter Jewish right wingers or fundamentalists, but they are not usual, and I wouldn’t normally come into contact with them…”
so looking up information on the internet is comming in contact with the person LOL what grade are you in lala seriously?
August 14th, 2006 at 3:12 am
Eeeeeef! The rest of Tworset’s reply came after I posted my last.
Tworset, mabrouk on the certainty of your worldview. I hope it is a comfort to you at least.
Why get hysterial at a meaningless threat to call welfare on you? Too stupid. And it was made by Kranky not me. I only find it funny because of your reaction - so silly!
Answering you further is time that will be lost forever, so I will cut my losses here.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:13 am
“You post opinions that seek to justify the murder of innocents. ”
Now I will cut the chase short, show me one post where I did justify the murder of innocents.
Awaiting.
Hint Hint post #19 ya habla
August 14th, 2006 at 3:16 am
“Excellent satire, Stan. You’ve brilliantly captured the mindset of someone twisted enough to rationalize cold-blooded murder. Bravo!”
I am just applying what I learned from some Israelis I encountered on the blogosphere over the past few weeks. When it comes to rationalizing cold blooded murder, you gotta admit: Israelis are the best in the game.
Its fun, give it a try
August 14th, 2006 at 3:19 am
“Why get hysterial at a meaningless threat to call welfare on you? ”
This is my business not yours. I’m glad your are cutting your posts short.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:27 am
“You come across as a bit of a fractured soul.”
Lala habibiti you calm down shewiya you make me laugh wallahi. Coffee eih we vessel eih we fractured soul eih? Eih el hebab elly betektebeih dah we enti mosh fahma haga khales kedda
I honor you a phd in psychology of an internet diagnosis provider
August 14th, 2006 at 3:53 am
Hi Stan,
I was composing a bitingly clever (if I may say so myself :)) reply, when I realized that my last comment can still perfectly function as a stay to your last comment. Henceforth: ” ”
But in terms of good ol’ human dencency, I’d like you to clarify something for me. Do you really think that the murder of Danny and Einat Haran was a justafiable act? Was your comment a roundabout (albiet, shockingly bloodthirsty) way of lamenting both Lebanese and Isreali civilian deaths? Or was it truely a condonement of Kuntar and his gang’s deeds?
August 14th, 2006 at 4:05 am
Daphne,
I’m not sure if you are new to SM or not but thanks for your reasonable post. I totally agree with you, in the meantime I would like to see the same logic applied to innocent Palestinian and Lebanese families.
It will be nice to see more comments like yours addressed to the Israelis.
Danny and Einat………Mohamed and Leila
Kuntar………….Beign or Sharon
August 14th, 2006 at 4:13 am
Holy sh*t, do you ever have a talent for making friends….:)
August 14th, 2006 at 4:24 am
Twosret,
Why engage with trolls?
KiKi darling, when I visit BC Vancouver I will come and see you in person, you can e-mail Raccoon to come and join us, threesome sounds great
Being a bully is not hard you know.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:26 am
You would know wouldn’t you as you are the #1 most fouled mouth bully.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:28 am
I love you darling, was having dreams about you the other night…ohhh you were so delicious. Just remember I’m Watching You!
August 14th, 2006 at 4:48 am
“I am just applying what I learned from some Israelis I encountered on the blogosphere over the past few weeks. When it comes to rationalizing cold blooded murder, you gotta admit: Israelis are the best in the game.
Its fun, give it a try”
I’ll decline on your offer of giving it a try, clearly you are far more experienced in such ventures than I am, but I must disagree with your assesment that Israelis are the best in the game when it comes to absurd moral comparisons and cold-blooded murder. Clearly, that honor belongs to Liberal/Marxist axis like yourself. They’ve killed tens of millions over the years and they still attempt to portray themselves as “peace activists.” Won’t they ever learn?
In fact, I think I saw Stan at a recent rally in the Bay Area:
http://www.zombietime.com/stop_the_us_israeli_war_8_12_2006/
August 14th, 2006 at 4:58 am
On my first comment on the war on Lebanon I would like to present to the pussies in Israel this checklist.
http://www.indybay.org/uploads/2006/08/12/2_israels_checklist.jpg
August 14th, 2006 at 5:08 am
Tommy,
You look great too
http://www.dropdeadugly.com/dp/1-75.htm
August 14th, 2006 at 5:21 am
Twosret,
To paraphrase Marge Simpson, “long time lurker, first time poster.” SM’s blog has been on my daily round of blogs for a while, but this is the first time I’ve every had the courage to post.
And to your point, I agree with you. Everyone is this conflict has at least a little blood on their hands. In an ideal world, each side would be dealing with their own sour elements. For instance, Israel would have held Sharon accountable for what he allowed the SLA to do in Lebanon. The Palestinians would be the loudest condemers of suicide bombers. And Kuntar would be rotting away in a Lebanese prison.
I think everyone wants to the other side to admit their wrongs first. Naturally, this system won’t get anyone anywhere, since it has a built in catch 22. Which is sad, because I think that just as the first step towards sobriety in the 12-Step program is admitting you have a mistake, the first step towards peace between Israel and her neighbors is for everyone to acknowledge their mistakes and wrong doings.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:25 am
I am going to sleep now Mo Mo, but tomorrow I will be investigating my options about your VERY PUBLIC threat to come pay me a visit.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:49 am
Don’t be a hothead, Mo:
http://tammybruce.com/archives/TurbanBomb.jpg
August 14th, 2006 at 6:06 am
Excuse me while I hurl.
Ariel Sharon should wake up, grab Olmert’s collar, and give him a sound trashing. Talk about rewarding an extremism.
August 14th, 2006 at 7:35 am
Wow, some sick stuff here. But, uh, just for the record, neither Twoshit nor anyone else (but me) actually read the page that twoshit sends us to. Nowhere on that page does Kuntar deny the killing of the Haran family, he just doesn’t boast of it (in English at least). In fact the page clearly says:
“The operation lasted from 2:00 to 5:00 a.m. Kuntar and his colleagues reached the seashore of Naharya where, in addition to the military base, there were also a police military academy, the coastal guards and artillery the naval alarm network, and the headquarters for the Israeli warship group.
Kuntar and his colleagues fought, at first, with a police patrol where an Israeli sergeant was killed. The group burst into a high building (number 61) in Jabootinski where they parted into two groups.
The battle that ended the operation took place when Kuntar tried to get closer to his boat at the seashore. Abdel Majeed got killed and Mhanna was seriously wounded in the head and later died. Kuntar had five bullets all over his body (a fact he mentioned in one of his letters). He was under fire from all directions after Kuntar fell to the ground, he was unable to move. The Israelis imprisoned Kuntar and his colleague Ahmed Al Abrass (who was later released in 1985 in a prisoners exchange operation).
The result of the operation was the death of 2 of the commandos group members, and the imprisonment of Kuntar and Al Abrass . On the Israeli’s side, 5 were killed and 12 others wounded.”
You do the math.
August 14th, 2006 at 7:35 am
It is absolutely insane that Israel doesn’t sentence people like that to death. They have at least a few dosen pre-meditated child murderers in jail - ie people who intentionally and specifically targeted children, with full knowledge and no real or perceived threat. Let me repeat for a couple of morons very active on this site: murder of children, intentional, pre-meditated, in full knowledge, with no immediate threat associated with them. Of any race or religion. Death sentence. Anyone objects?
August 14th, 2006 at 8:05 am
Dude,
Quntar may be a monster a child molester a beast, whatever.
But if releasing him means less Israeli and Lebanese children will die then what kind of justice is it we insist that he stays in jail EVEN if that means more children will die ?
Why is the child he killed more important that all the children who died because he has to face justice ?
Damn it if you don’t want to release him kill him and get it over with. That’ll be 1117 Lebanese dead instead of 1116
here a funny thought when Hizballah kidnapped the two soldiers Israel should have responded by immediately killing quntar and the other 4 or five Lebanese prisoners they have.
Hezbollah would have been pissed as hell and killed the two soldiers they have.
A few casualties form both sides Hizballah would have learned kidnapping will not get them what they want no civilian Israelis killed no civilian Lebanese killed 80 Israeli soldiers lives spared and hizballah learns a lesson.
But noooooo how can I suggest Israel kills the prisoners! That’s murder, they can always have a nice little war where they kill hundreds of innocents in clear conscience.
As stupid as this may seem what Israel did is ten times stupider.
Just ranting.
August 14th, 2006 at 8:16 am
Twosret, you just lost the little respect you salvaged from me along the month.Samir Kuntar is a child-murderer and a monster, he should rot in jail for his whole life as a warning that those who intentionally target children *never* get out.
As to the site you liked to, if you read hebrew, would you consider this to be unbiased site?And what about this one?The first is a Kahana Khai webpage glorifying him and, the second a forum disscussion where it is claimed it is all an Arab conspiracy andhe killed nobody.Personaly both make me want to puke.Both are on about the same level of bias as the webpage you linked to.
August 14th, 2006 at 8:18 am
ps.on the scond paragraph “him” refers to Baruch Goldstein, of course.Sorry for the possible confusion.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:21 am
Anonymous Leb, your rant was actually quite lucid. In the cold calculus of war, having lost two soldiers would have been better than 100, and one child-killer far better than hundreds of children. Many have accused Israel of having motives beyond the release of their soldiers, and I think that’s true. Israel’s war was about meeting the challenge of provocation and reminding Lebanon that, despite their bluster and chest-thumping, Hezbollah fighters CANNOT defend the nation.
August 14th, 2006 at 10:17 am
It seems to me judging from some of the comments here, that some people can’t be reached. For some crushing the skull of a little gilr is equivelant to israeli airstrikes. Some people just live in a different reality.
Of course they would say the same thing about me. The interesting thing is that all muslim countries are failures. both the ones supported by western governments and the ones opposed to western governments.
It seems logical to me that people who are no capable of grasping reality would have a hard time running a modern country.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:09 am
Pretty shocking reading, to be quite honest…
The fact that (seemingly) sane people can find it in themselves to do anything but unconditionally condemn the likes of Quntar is beyond me. The mere fact that so many arabs can support Hizbollah, when their agenda features the release of of a child-murderer is equally mindboggling.
People… There is a HUGE difference between ‘legitimate’ acts of war and criminal actions. War, while not pretty and certainly not desirable, is a conflict between nations, where casualties are a sad fact of life. Crushing the skull of a child is a henious crime, no matter what circumstances lay behind, and should find sympathy from noone, regardless of their position in the conflict.
As for the idea that you can actually compensate one death for several others in cold rationale, this is completely absurd. The guilty must meet their punishment regardless of the consequences, lest the public’s sense of justice be completely lost. The alternative would quite certainly be much worse, ie. thousands of Quntar-copies all over the arab world, when it becomes evident that it is without consequence to smash the head of a 4-year old girl with a rifle butt!
August 14th, 2006 at 11:22 am
Hizballah Wants Israel to Free Child-Killer
You can’t win the war against Islamic fascism and prevent them from obtaining their global caliphate that they seek, by loosing everytime you have the opportunity to win. This, and still no consequences for Iran and Syria’s role in this war.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:24 am
Maybe the day we realise that the horror of state sponsored murder (by Israel, Lebanon, US, HB, Ba’ath or any-damn-body) is no more excusable than the foul and disgusting murder of that little girl, that will be the day we realise that people in power of religious or secular organisations only use force when they are too stupid to use brains to achieve their ends.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:33 am
Adam B., well said. I agree. There is no comparison between accidential acts of war and criminal actions. Smashing the head in of a small defenseless child is a cowardly, shameful act. No one should defend that action no matter what.
Loyalty to one’s cause is admirable but not when it blinds a person to truth and justice.
I am 100% Pro-Israel, and I am also 100% Pro-Arab—there is no contradiction here. It would be nice if everyone could put aside differences, accept their diversity, and live in peace. This antagonism between groups is crazy. It does not serve the best interests of either group. It is insane.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:03 pm
Isdor ,Adam B: save your breath. You cannot try to use common sense when dealing with middle eastern honor and revenge mindset. You can smash a childs head open if the country she was born in is your enemy. Kuntar knew back in school he would be a martyr,not a doctor saving lives, not a chemist developing cures for diseases, a jihadi, a killer, lofty goals indeed. The undying admiration of many of his people, his tribe just one of the benefits. Apparently SM doesn’t buy into this horseshit code so he gets flamed by Twosret, eee, and others. Then you get Mohamid, say something he doesn’t agree with and he threatens a visit. Common sense, not with this mindset.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:09 pm
number 5 tworet
indeed golda was right . there are no palestinians. there are arabs who were prevented from going back to their homelands by the arab league. the only palestiniasn pre 1948 were those people who had palestinian passports. these were people who had legally immigrated to the British mandate and were mainly jews. the arabs who doubled their number post 1922 were mostly illegal immigrants coming to get jobs. Most the arabs in the British Mandate had moved therer within the last few years to get jobs. they were not born there and they did not get there legally. But post war, teh UN had a problem. the arab league prevented any refugee from repatriating to his respective homeland. And UNwra was designed to keep these people hostage. they defined “refugee” as anybody who could claim, not prove, that they had been in British Plaestine for a year or two, no longer. If you claimed that, you got free food and shelter and health care.
Zionist propaganda?: hardly. its all at the UN and at the avalon project. Start reading the british mandate reports from British palestine and the Security Council reports from 1947 onward. the UN has redacted some of them to make them more pro arab. certain pappers are left out of the library for public viewing ( thye were present pre 2000) . Still, the data for the most part is there.
There is no mention of palestinians in the 1948 UN agreement, it is between arabs and jews. and there is no mention in the world until after the 73 war. At that time UN242 was passed, which called for an agreement between warring states. In order to implement 242 a new state had to be fabricated because Jordan had no legal title to the land and would likely sign a peace treaty with Israel and legally cede the disputed land of the west bank to Israel. The term palestinian is a propaganda construct
to invent a state that could be “occupied” and could be negotiated with. UN242 was fulfilled with Jordan and Egypt legally and fully. Lebanon still has not signed a peace treaty with Israel
August 14th, 2006 at 12:21 pm
So whats new in this entire rigmorole! Wasn’t it clear from day one of this entire mess that unless and until the Israelis were willing to risk a full-scale military invasion of Lebanon and Syria, and crush the Hizbollah machinery to crumbs, that some sort of ‘negotiated settlement’ (Terrrorist Turd out to wallow in the muck yards of Lebanon & bring the boys back home; I’ve got an election coming right after this!) would have been the only solution, unless of course, the Israelis were willing to let the lost soldiers remain a statistic.
Kuntar may well be released and so will be a few of his ‘Pali’ brethren and the only real war he may fight ever again will be with some underaged sex slave in one of those brothels that Beirut is famous for. And then the Hizbollah might make him a hero out of him, as a prized trophy of it’s campaign that might only have left Lebanon with a $ 11 Bn. deficit( so who cares! Didn’t Allah’s Party win the war?) And then no matter what they say they will end up gaining more seats in the next Lebanese elections which can take place anytime between now and 2 years hence.
The Net Result:
The Winnner: Round One to Hizbollah in a knock out!
Hassan Nassrallah !
He got what he wanted and some more, what with all the gory pictures coming out courtsey Reuters, AP, AFP et al., I just can imagine the so called Arab street brimming with enthusiastic recruits for the next round. (” Dad! When I grow up I will be martyr and kill as many infidels as possible. That way I get to have a go at 72 ‘pristine pieces’ for the rest of my ‘eternal life’”)
Basshar al-Assad: So our knock-knee soldier gets to win a war. It feels really good! When was the last time that Syria won a war? No! I am not talking about the Assyrians. Problem is, he will find it hard to motor along once the Euphoria runs dry and then the ‘Shia brethren’ of the ‘brave resistance’ will start asking for a larger share of the pie. (” Maybe I should have stuck to the cushy job in London”)
The Casualties:
Ehud Olmert: Sharon’s successor couldn’t live up to his mentor. To all of those aspiring politicians (including Guiliani, who I am told has a mind to run for the primaries come November next, the fact that you can get your sanitation workers to do a decent job DOES NOT mean that you can run a country) Do I see another Ehud (Who?) Barak in the making?
Amir Peretz: The ‘joker’ from Histadrut made a mockery of his job and will be the first casualty amongst the heavy-weights. (”That woman ‘Condy’ Rice was mighty mad that I kept her in the dark about what happened in Qana, during our meeting, but you gotta admit something, after all there is only so much that a guy can do at a time! Besides, I was only trying to break this gently to her in my own way.”) But then being one amongst the ‘toilers’ he will find his way back to the Knesset to insult the institution of Parliament, atleast till he is given an ‘honorable’ retirement
Tzipi Livni: Ah! That woman would have been the only thing worth seeing in an Israeli cabinet meeting! Incompetence is a crime, only when commited by balding men and greying women , so our ‘fair lady’ gets to live another day , but not for a long time( atleast not as Foreign Minister) . You dont belong to one of those dynasties in Israeli politics for nothing.
The Israelis:
142 deaths in a months time and they might be wondering as to what the most well equipped army in the middle east was doing all this time and perhaps it will upset the leftist applecart in Israel for the better part of the next decade.
IDF: One incompetent bungling after another! I think this was Israels war to lose. The IDF’s reputation will take a lot of battering and so will its policies on the ground. So much for leaflets and radio announcements. And maybe they will get a media manager with atleast an ounce of grey matter where it matters.
Peace NOW!: Haven’t heard from them for a long time. Last week some moonbats did a protest outside the Israeli Army Command in Negev( What’s wrong in looking for a safe place to protest?) It will be a while before they get an audience outside ‘liberal’ European Universities and Gaypride/ WSF festivals.
The Losers:
The Lebanese People: Although the majority of the ‘civilians’ killed were either the ‘friendly-neighbourhood-resistance-fighters’ and their kith and kin( maybe they should ask the Lebanese Government to pay for Underground Family Bunkers for the next round) the destruction of the infrastructure will set them back by many years and atleast take them 3 years to rebuild ( if the Hizbollah doesn’t start round 2 that is)
…………………..That about sums it up I guess, Oh No! How could I forget?
The News Agencies: The next time you see all those dramatic pictures, just remember to take it with a pinch of salt! The world is swarming with Adnan Hajjs and Salam Dahers and Kathleen Carrolls, not to mention ‘objective journalists’ like Kathy Gannon. So the next time you see the pictures of a dead baby or hear about ‘massacres’ wait for atleast a couple of months to see whether or not there is any dispute or retraction of the figures. If not you can safely conclude that the half the number mentioned in the figures might have died and maybe, just maybe the child is really dead.
August 14th, 2006 at 12:22 pm
I am sure all you SM lot would accuse me of defending Quntar…I am not, and I hope he rots in jail, and then goes to hell and get his skull crushed every ten seconds for eternity…but what many of you are saying is that if you crush a childs skull with a cluster bomb dropped from an F-16 then that’s completely kosher, but if you do it with a rifle butt then you’re a child-murderer? I guess the cluster bomb was aimed at the whole apartment block not at the child…
I guess if you don’t see the child dying it’s easier not to feel guilty about it…
August 14th, 2006 at 12:27 pm
Historian…do you make up history to suit you as you go along? or do you choose one source that agrees with your ideology most?
another case of selective amnesia accompanied by national pride syndrome…most Arabs have that disease as well–it’s highly contagious…
August 14th, 2006 at 12:40 pm
Iranian president got a blog,
check it here, but you may get in trouble :
http://ws.giyus.org/points/point?id=129
August 14th, 2006 at 12:47 pm
Yes, Twos, I was talking to you!!!
Here’s the thing: Kuntar BRAGGED about the killings. He’s PROUD of smashing a little girl’s head in. SM’s account IS Kuntar’s side of the story by his own admission.
The fact that you accuse the mother of killing the other child is a travesty - especially for a mother! You should be ashamed of yourself. The mother hid with her youngest child and accidentally smothered her while trying to keep her quiet so that Kuntar wouldn’t discover them. As a mother, I would hope you would try to protect your child if a blood thirsty maniac broke into your home. And if you should accidentally kill that child in the attempt, I would hope I would sympathize with you instead of accusing you. Really, Twos, your comment was just shameful!
Israeli bombs kill children and that’s tragic. But the Israelis (and for that matter, sane Arabs) don’t actually TARGET children. Kuntar did. Frankly, I don’t know why Lebanon would want him back. If I were Lebanese I’d be afraid that he would go all Wahabi on my ass and start killing people who weren’t “Muslim enough”. This asshole is a psycopath and not worth HA endangering a SINGLE Lebanese life for. See what I’m saying?
My sarcastic response results from Arabs NEVER admitting anything. You fell into that in your post. “An Arab did that? IMPOSSIBLE! MUST be a conspiracy.” A few years ago an Egyptian guy by the name of Hesham lost his mind in LAX and sprayed people with bullets. The incident was investigated and it turned out that Hesham was not a terrorist but a run of the mill loony. However, even though there were about 100 eye-witnesses and footage from several security cameras, his wife - upon seeing the videotapes - said that he didn’t do what he did and that the very accusation was a Western conspiracy against Islam. So her crazy, loony husband now represents all of Islam. Yadi el neelah!?!?! Magnoon Giden!!
August 14th, 2006 at 1:00 pm
Anonymous Leb - although I have a principle problem with the idea of releasing any convicted murderer and an even greater problem with any deals with terrorist (or for that matter plain criminal) hostage-takers, I can follow your logic. But unfortunately for both of us your basic premise does not hold.
If it did we could have had a peace deal signed years ago. We would have said “here you take the Sheba Farms and deal with the Syrians and here is Kutub - you can release him or have him serve out his natural life in your jails” and you would have responded “we’ve just signed a peace deal and you want to screw us with Sheba Farms, the Syrians and sickos like Kutub”.
The reality is that HB doesn’t give a sh*t for the Sheba Farms or Kutub and if they didn’t exist it would be something else. Their stated agenda is clearly the liberation of el Kuds, the destruction of the Zionist entity and the hastening of the relevation of the Mahdi. And we are not likely to agree to any of those. I don’t think it would be wise for you to agree either, if only because we have no intention of going quietly.
So that leaves you with the quandry of whether you are willing to be their playground or not. And it is a real quandry.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:01 pm
Alaa,
“I am sure all you SM lot would accuse me of defending Quntar…”
No, I wouldn’t.
“but what many of you are saying is that if you crush a childs skull with a cluster bomb dropped from an F-16 then that’s completely kosher, but if you do it with a rifle butt then you’re a child-murderer? I guess the cluster bomb was aimed at the whole apartment block not at the child…”
I can only speak for myself but here’s what I think on that subject:
When you crush a child’s skull, you kill the child on purpose. When You are blowing up military objectives and a child you didn’t know was there gets killed, you did not do it on purpose. It takes a special beast to kill a child by crushing their skull with your own hands (holding a weapon, of course). THAT is the difference between the two.
Let’s be clear on my personal position here: The death of a child is TRAGIC. Always. No matter whose fault it is. No question. No argument.
But this is what I wonder about (maybe you can help me with the answer): Part of the reason Israeli casualties are so much lower is because Israel builds bomb shelters for their population.
In the 6 years that HA has been digging its tunnels under civilian structures - like rats - all over Southern Lebanon, they have built NOT ONE bomb shelter for the civilians it means to endanger in its attempt to “liberate Palestine”. You would think that HA is responsible for protecting their OWN civilians. Why aren’t they? More to the point - why isn’t the Arab Street holding them responsible for that? And wy isn’t the Arab street crying over Israeli children killed by HA’s Katyusha rockets? Aren’t all children precious?
August 14th, 2006 at 1:02 pm
Sorry, Kuntar not Kutub
August 14th, 2006 at 1:07 pm
So Alaa, you looked up the UN files Historian referred us to and he was wrong? Tell us please what is in the UN files. Don’t just say he’s wrong and then stop. As to your prior post, on the one hand Israeli pilot in a war, following orders. On the other hand a terrorist killing a little girls father in front of her and then crushing her head, killing her. If Danny and his daughter had known Kuntar was coming, had gotten a leaflet telling him so and waited around for it to happen it would be almost identical. Except for that personal Kuntar touch and the 20 minutes of abject terror leading up to her final seconds. People are dying and that is horrific. Period. Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us. Golda Meir.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:09 pm
*sighs*
Alaa and others, you don’t seem to get a very obvious point.
Samir Quntar drags an unarmed man out of his apartment and shoots him in cold blood in front of his young daughter, then bashes his head in with a rock.
Hizballah stores rockets in a mosque and a hospital and launches them at Israeli cities from the closest possible point to a Lebanese Sunni village so as to draw Israeli return fire.
Israel calls villagers by phone and warns them to get out, then a day later bombs the village from which HA continues to fire rockets at Israeli cities.
Rather than sending the local civilians into its bunkers to keep them seafe, HA hides its own people there. Israeli return fire unintentionally kills the local civilians.
Is that the same thing as Quntar’s action? Of course not. One side is deliberately targeting civilians. The other side is trying its damndest not to, and USUALLY succeeding but sometimes failing.
Yes, this example has been “cleaned up” because I’m explaining the difference between deliberate massacres and accidental massacres. Get the point please.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:21 pm
Twosret, I know that you won’t read this, but I just can’t help myself: you are completely INSANE!
Sandmonkey posts about the widelyknown barbarities of “someone” that smashed the brain of a 4 year old girl with the butt of his rifle… and you want to compromise on THAT? To listen to the other side of the story? What part of “we can’t trust anything that the other side says because they lie through their teeth” didn’t you get? What part of “Hizballah says that relief trucks can’t get to hit areas because of Israeli destruction”, but for some reason journalists - led by Hizballah members - can, and Hizballah can even move wreckage from the original sites?
What part of “We can’t trust people” that violate the sanctity of a dead child’s remains to distort reality by producing propaganda? http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=22092_AP_Circles_the_Wagons_Around_Green_Helmet_Guy&only
And Golda Meir was right: there are no Palestinians. That people never existed. There are Egyptian and Jordanian refugees (for the most part, late XIX and XX century immigrants) who were taught (brainwashed) to believe that they were Palestinians. There are no Palestinians, but there is a thriving Palestinian film industry. (Watch the documentary CBS 60 minutes documentary “PALLYWOOD” about the extent of Palestinian propaganda) http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=22061&only
Shaskespeare said it: the world is a stage, and we are all mere actors - but some take this more seriously than others. Keep living in lala land.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:24 pm
Howard,
It’s useless. The dominant explanation for everything in the ME is a conspiracy theory.
The premise of everything is that “we” can attack with the stated purpose of anahilation but “they” have no right to shoot back. Any wrong against us is unforgivable for eternity. We, on the other hand are never wrong. If one accepts that as “logic”, then one is a lost cause.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:30 pm
I agree with Stan and Alaa completely!
Obviously, the little girl, and the Lebanese children, are both accidental victims of war. On the one hand, you have Lebanese children, forced by terrorist scum to live in and around Hezbollah rocket launchers, arms depots, firing positions, etc, so that when an Israeli pilot attempts to destroy a rocket launcher, he might hit the kids. On the other hand, the little girl might very well have been concealing an Israeli commando squad in her ear canal, which was clearly the target when the terrorist bashed her head in. Now, you may argue that the little girl was already a prisoner, under their control, but remember, this was an ISRAELI little girl, and therefore a Hezbollah man, even an adult, combat trained terrorist, is always outmatched, so we can never consider the little girl a prisoner. You might also answer, this is all stupid, we all know that Hezbollah will keep weapons in civilian homes, but a little girl can’t hide weapons! But remember, this is true, but only obvious to you and I. Hezbollah types and their supporters, and people like Twosret and Alaa, are not that intelligent, and can’t understand the relative difficulty of hiding a stockpile of weapons on a little girl vs hiding a stockpile of weapons in an apartment building. I mean, can’t you see? Bombing a building because rockets are coming out of it, beating on a little girl because… because she’s got an Israeli artillery firing position set up in her hair, same thing, right? Do not besmirch the thinking of Hezbollah supporters, merely because they have a very limited understanding of reality, it is racist.
Ben
August 14th, 2006 at 1:31 pm
“The fact that you accuse the mother of killing the other child is a travesty - especially for a mother! You should be ashamed of yourself.”
I accused the mother ? where did I do that? I only said that the girl died before the beach incident.
WHERE IN SM POST did he refer to Kuntar BRAGGING about it? WHERE DID IT SAY IN KUNTAR story that he is proud of smashing a skull?.
“Twos, your comment was just shameful!”
And you have a major comprehension problem that needs to addressed and a serious attitude that is fueld by low IQ.
Before your very idiotic sarcastic response, I have posted nothing but a post by his family or him to tell the story only tell the story.
“9/11 was concocted by Bush himself to go to war with Islam”
No Ya Roh Omek it was Bin Laden, the Bin Laden that Saudi Arabia kicked out and took away the Saudi nationality from him (wink wink at your hubby) and we the Americans gave hime money and weapons to fight for us the Russians. Same goes with Saddam we loved him when we needed him and pictures of him and Rumsfield were cute until we decided to get rid of him and invade Iraq.
This how you and your husband sound like hypocrites, simply because you vote twice for Bush who kiss the King of Saudi Arabia (YIKES) and flies the Bin Laden back hom to Saudi when our nation is mourning to PROTECT them. And you and your hubby come here to fling accusations.
Who are you ya kharia to speak of what people think politically, I’m the one who lost two second cousins in 9/11 not you. I was one of the first to be on the scene with other Physicians that rushed to save lives, while you were watching your little T.V. at your comfy home.
So go and butt off instead of comming her like an idiot khariya speaking nonsense.
August 14th, 2006 at 1:44 pm
Twoshits: “And you have a major comprehension problem that needs to addressed and a serious attitude that is fueld by low IQ.”
BWHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHAA!!!!!!
Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
Twoshits: “I’m the one who lost two second cousins in 9/11 not you. I was one of the first to be on the scene with other Physicians that rushed to save lives, while you were watching your little T.V. at your comfy home.”
Like anybody would believe that.
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!!!!!
August 14th, 2006 at 1:45 pm
And for the Israeli supporters who claims that we should believe them blindly and not even question their stories, I show them what their politicans are like, and why we think you are terrorists and cold blood murderers.
“1. “There is a huge gap between us (Jews) and our enemies not just in ability but in morality, culture, sanctity of life, and conscience. They are our neighbors here, but it seems as if at a distance of a few hundred meters away, there are people who do not belong to our continent, to our world, but actually belong to a different galaxy.” Israeli president Moshe Katsav. The Jerusalem Post, May 10, 2001
2. “The Palestinians are like crocodiles, the more you give them meat, they want more”…. Ehud Barak, Prime Minister of Israel at the time - August 28, 2000. Reported in the Jerusalem Post August 30, 2000
3. ” [The Palestinians are] beasts walking on two legs.” Menahim Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, “Begin and the Beasts”. New Statesman, 25 June 1982.
**************this one is a masterpiece*********************
4. “The Palestinians” would be crushed like grasshoppers … heads smashed against the boulders and walls.” ” Israeli Prime Minister (at the time) in a speech to Jewish settlers New York Times April 1, 1988
********************************************************
5. “When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle.” Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.
6. “How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to.” Golda Meir, March 8, 1969.
7. “There was no such thing as Palestinians, they never existed.” Golda Maier Israeli Prime Minister June 15, 1969
8. “The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June 1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff, which was born and developed after the war.” Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha’aretz, 19 March 1972.
***********************Attention**************************
9. David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister): “If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti - Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?” Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paraddoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121.
********************************************************
9a. Ben Gurion also warned in 1948 : “We must do everything to insure they ( the Palestinians) never do return.” Assuring his fellow Zionists that Palestinians will never come back to their homes. “The old will die and the young will forget.”
10. “We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves.” Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.
11. “Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don’t worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it.” - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001, to Shimon Peres, as reported on Kol Yisrael radio. (Certainly the FBI’s cover-up of the Israeli spy ring/phone tap scandal suggests that Mr. Sharon may not have been joking.
12. “We declare openly that the Arabs have no right to settle on even one centimeter of Eretz Israel… Force is all they do or ever will understand. We shall use the ultimate force until the Palestinians come crawling to us on all fours.” Rafael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defense Forces - Gad Becker, Yediot Ahronot 13 April 1983, New York Times 14 April 1983.
13. “We must do everything to ensure they [the Palestinian refugees] never do return” David Ben-Gurion, in his diary, 18 July 1948, quoted in Michael Bar Zohar’s Ben-Gurion: the Armed Prophet, Prentice-Hall, 1967, p. 157.
15. “We should prepare to go over to the offensive. Our aim is to smash Lebanon, Trans-Jordan, and Syria. The weak point is Lebanon, for the Moslem regime is artificial and easy for us to undermine. We shall establish a Christian state there, and then we will smash the Arab Legion, eliminate Trans-Jordan; Syria will fall to us. We then bomb and move on and take Port Said, Alexandria and Sinai.” David Ben-Gurion, May 1948, to the General Staff. From Ben-Gurion, A Biography, by Michael Ben-Zohar, Delacorte, New York 1978.
16. “We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population.” Israel Koenig, “The Koenig Memorandum”
17. “Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population.” Moshe Dayan, address to the Technion, Haifa, reported in Haaretz, April 4, 1969.
18. “We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?’ Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said ‘Drive them out!’” Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.
19. Rabin’s description of the conquest of Lydda, after the completion of Plan Dalet. “We shall reduce the Arab population to a community of woodcutters and waiters” Uri Lubrani, PM Ben-Gurion’s special adviser on Arab Affairs, 1960. From “The Arabs in Israel” by Sabri Jiryas.
20. “There are some who believe that the non-Jewish population, even in a high percentage, within our borders will be more effectively under our surveillance; and there are some who believe the contrary, i.e., that it is easier to carry out surveillance over the activities of a neighbor than over those of a tenant. [I] tend to support the latter view and have an additional argument:…the need to sustain the character of the state which will henceforth be Jewish…with a non-Jewish minority limited to 15 percent. I had already reached this fundamental position as early as 1940 [and] it is entered in my diary.” Joseph Weitz, head of the Jewish Agency’s Colonization Department. From Israel: an Apartheid State by Uri Davis, p.5.
21. “Everybody has to move, run and grab as many hilltops as they can to enlarge the settlements because everything we take now will stay ours… Everything we don’t grab will go to them.” Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.
22. “It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands.” Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972.
23. “Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment… Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly.” Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization, speaking of the Arabs of Palestine, Complete Diaries, June 12, 1895 entry. “ “
August 14th, 2006 at 1:59 pm
Alaa,
“Historian…do you make up history to suit you as you go along? or do you choose one source that agrees with your ideology most?
another case of selective amnesia accompanied by national pride syndrome…most Arabs have that disease as well–it’s highly contagious…”
Ditto, and also the same here, the Twosret hate fest is simply because when someone lives out of the M.E. for 20 years and hear a name and a story and DARE to check out what the other side is saying, then they are supporting the killing of a child.
No matter how many THOUSANDS of posts I posted to condenm the killing of innocent children (Lebanese and Palestinians) it doesn’t matter to them, back then when I criticized the state of Israel I’m doomed to be a Terrorist, now I’m a a murderer supporter, You are doomed either way, only because they are LEBANESE AND PALESTINIANS,they don’t give a shit but a story of an Israeli girl questioned? OH NO The RAbbI’s issues a fatwa to Kill Twosret the supporter.
Okay Rabbi’s of Israel continue your Jihad against Twosret.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:13 pm
Twos,
You're an insane, you know that?
Here are two quotes from you:
"I didn’t see him posting anything related to any child killings, on the other hand the mother admitted that she put her hand on her child mouth and she died on the hands of her motherI accused the mother ? where did I do that? I only said that the girl died before the beach incident."
"I accused the mother ? where did I do that?"
It must be time for your pills again, huh?
"Before your very idiotic sarcastic response, I have posted nothing but a post by his family or him to tell the story only tell the story."
You're a true saint. A true saint, you delusional troll.
"No Ya Roh Omek it was Bin Laden, the Bin Laden that Saudi Arabia kicked out and took away the Saudi nationality from him (wink wink at your hubby) and we the Americans gave hime money and weapons to fight for us the Russians".
Bin Laden was kicked out AFTER the Afghani war when he decided he wanted to terrorize the whole world. We, the Americans (which you don't consider yourself to be because you're all harrassed and shit by them) armed him to free Afghanistan of soviet domination, ya hoomarah. At least know some history before you comment on it. I suppose you also think that we deserve 9/11 because, after all, we gave the attackers visas into our country and we have no right to question them becuase that's tantemount to harrassment. Your biggest problem is neither innocense nor hypocracy but rank stupidity.
You're so cute and civilized, Twos. I'm sure I'll get a chance to see them on an FBI "Most Wanted" list.
"This how you and your husband sound like hypocrites, simply because you vote twice for Bush who kiss the King of Saudi Arabia (YIKES) and flies the Bin Laden back hom to Saudi when our nation is mourning to PROTECT them. And you and your hubby come here to fling accusations"
No! In your medieval mind you think that the entire Bin Laden family should have been skinned alive for the actions of ONE of their number. Because Osama's actions put THIS particular Arab family at higher danger of retaliation by incensed Americans, the US government helped them get to safetly. I know in your tiny autocratic little mind we should have had a public hanging of all of them. THEN you scream that Arabs are discriminated against. Which is it, hoomarah?
"Who are you ya kharia to speak of what people think politically, I’m the one who lost two second cousins in 9/11 not you."
I can't help it if your second cousins decided to fly a plane into a building on Bin Laden's order! That's your problem. I'm sure you find it justifiable in your terrorist mind.
We both worked at WTC. My husband and I barely escaped with our lives. We walked for hours to get home. I lost countless friends and clients because of your cousin. I LIVE in this city. How dare you lecture me about 9/11! Maybe you've not met with "ignorance" against you because you're Arab - maybe it's a reaction to your disgusting personality.
God help us if you're really a physician!
August 14th, 2006 at 2:22 pm
Twosret,
You do touch a nerve to some people here, I’m glad you are bringing out their insanity and hate. anonon shares the same traits of Bush supporters, she is sick and wild.
Don’t waste your breath, don’t feed the trolls ya benti!
August 14th, 2006 at 2:26 pm
Very low Israeli crowd, abusers, harassers, aggressors, brining in people personal life to attack their views is pretty darn low life conversation. Calling someone a slut only goes to show who is speaking.
I would like to extend Twosret an invitation to stop replying to such dirty minded, low life posters.
August 14th, 2006 at 2:44 pm
Twosret, I notice your quotes include none that are later then october 3rd 2001, and do not include anybody currently performing any active role in the Israeli goverment(the president is not an active part of decision making- all he can do is talk, and he tries not to do much of that currently as he’s under investigation;).Would you like me to dig around in the collected sayings of the Arab leaders to find some of the more recent samples?
August 14th, 2006 at 2:53 pm
I would like to thank Daphne, The Historian, for your balanced remarks eventhough I spot some disagreements with the historian. The gap between the two nations is sadly huge and so many people are willing to slit throats of commentators who might speak different.
The dead children you are defending people are of the same quality and importance of the quality of Twosret’s children you brought into your arguement to strengthen your vicious attacks against Twosret, using someone personal information to hurt them is a crime.
Disgrace and Shame you bring to your cause. This is my final word and I hope it will be Twosret last post on this topic.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:16 pm
Oh, by the fucking Gods… why does it always have to deteriorate into pointless insults?
As always - a post by SM that points out a wrong done by an Arab/Muslim. An attempt to refute it by moral equivalence and sophistry. Attempts to refute the refutal by appeals to reason. More sophistry, moral equivalence and demagoguery. Insults follow; the whole thing becomes a pointless verbal fight.
Why?
Anonon and Louise - why the hell do you attack? If you have anger management issues, learn martial arts, don’t contaminate the Web (unless it’s funny, and in this case it most certainly is not). Don’t shit where you eat.
The reasonable and reasoning posters: best of luck.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:29 pm
I still can’t find anything from Twosret to attack the mother in any way for the death of the child. I look but there’s nothing there.
The problem is that Twosret is most often the person chucking insults about people when they disagree with her even mildly. Most people ignore it, some obviously don’t to an alarming degree.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:37 pm
Raccoon,
read post #76 and tell me who attacked whom. Then read post *74 where she claims persecution. There’s apparantly a “jihad against twosret”.
This is typical of a Hezbollah supporter: ” I can shoot you but you can’t shoot back.”
August 14th, 2006 at 3:38 pm
Here is how I see this bitter conflict;
SM: posts a storyof Kuntar.
Twosret :(clearly never heard of him before) googles the name of the guy and post a link to the guy site (very clearly not knowing who he is). Making a reasonable attempt to view both stories.
Abusers: revolt big time OMG !!!!!and practice what they know best, slander, bash, abuse, and drag Twosret, family, children, falsely accuse her to be a terrorist and even the sad event of her two second cousins that she lost (condolences Twosret) are abused to the greatest extent to falsely and illegaly claim that her losses are the actual terrorists of 9/11. Another abuse to two DEAD people.
Being first on the scene shows bravery, love to this country, and by no means you do not deserve insults, accusations, hate, for doing your duty. You are one fine woman and not any different from our police officers, fire fighters,and all those who helped.
I’m appalled, disgusted, and sorry for you being abused by others. Please read more on Kantur and best of luck to you. Don’t despair there are few people who can give you the benefit of the doubt and understand.
(I doubt it if you are interested in posting anything among the barbaric crowd here).
August 14th, 2006 at 3:39 pm
I certainly also read an accusation toward the mother in Twosret’s post - I find it fairly obvious…
August 14th, 2006 at 3:47 pm
Canicula,
I perceived the comment she made as an indictment of the mother.
“The problem is that Twosret is most often the person chucking insults about people when they disagree with her even mildly. Most people ignore it, some obviously don’t to an alarming degree.”
On second thought. You’re right. This is the first time I’ve experienced Twos’s personal attacks and I should have just written her off as crazy rather than wasting my time attacking back.
Point taken.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:50 pm
Anonon - it doesn’t really matter. This is the web, missiles don’t fly here. If Twosret is bothering you - ignore Twosret. Or laugh at her. Or refute her words (yes, it requires a lot of patience).
But verbal abuse in this case is just shitting where you eat - it almost invariably makes conversation impossible, pisses SM off and makes a Raccon want to vomit whenever I look at the comments (and I eat garbage for lunch!). In other words, it’s not only useless - it’s very detrimental. You’re not really shooting back - you’re just slinging insults, which have very different effects than bullets. What have you gained from this? What has anyone gained from this?
I am still trying to understand Twosret’s irrational hatred for Israel and various related issues. Maybe if I can understand them, I can find a cure.
*shrugs*
Bugger it, I am off.
August 14th, 2006 at 3:51 pm
“I didn’t hear of him until SM posted his topic, his site says the story different, I didn’t see him posting anything related to any child killings, on the other hand the mother admitted that she put her hand on her child mouth and she died on the hands of her mother. The rest of the story of the mother wasn’t clear to me that is why I did google to find other sources.”
This is not an accusation, it is repeating a fact posted on SM story, so when it came from the mother it was Okay and when Twosret simply repeated the fact, it means she is accusing the mother?!
What did you eat for breakfast?! Don’t they feed you there?
Here is what you don’t want to read Adam, because reading this might prove you wrong.
Twosret said : “no innocent should be dragged into military fights, that is exactly why I oppose war on Lebanon and the innocent being killed. I’m examining both sides of the stories.”
But the blind hate can’t even read Post#19 to Stan which I find excellent and I quote her:
“If we are against Israel for it’s wrong doings of killing innocent children and womenin Palestine and Lebanon, then we should not justify killing another innocent on the hand of military/resistance group.”
August 14th, 2006 at 3:57 pm
Kiki said “I am going to sleep now Mo Mo, but tomorrow I will be investigating my options about your VERY PUBLIC threat to come pay me a visit.”
You actually believe that I would care to visit you? Public threat? are you on the most wanted list? I don’t give a rat ass to see you, I can’t even stand your posts and abuse to others. I was putting you in place because your harassement to Twosret and insults needed some response. Get a life will ya?
The Raccoon,
Good for you man.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:04 pm
“I didn’t see him posting anything related to any child killings, on the other hand the mother admitted that she put her hand on her child mouth and she died on the hands of her mother.”
Sorry, but in my ears this reads: “hey, he hasn’t admitted to killing children, so he probably hasn’t. The mother on the other hand even admitted to killing her child!”
No thought whatsoever to the fact that her oh-so-innocent arab freedom fighter posed such a threat that the mother was forced to silence her child, accidentally killing it in the process. Commenting that “the mother is the only one who seems to have killed someone” is pretty much as low as I can think of. If you think differently, so be it.
“What did you eat for breakfast?! Don’t they feed you there?”
Talk about personal slander…! It’s a good thing the net exists, isn’t it? Else you wouldn’t have such opportunity for verbal abuse, not without serious risk to you health, that is. Keep it up, buddy, and nobody will take you seriously…
The real problem here (not mudflinging - that’s just childish misbehaviour) is your quote from Twosret… “no innocent should be dragged into military fights, that is exactly why I oppose war on Lebanon and the innocent being killed. I’m examining both sides of the stories.” I agree completely and I suspect most westerners, including Israeles, do as well. Hizbollah, on the other hand, seem to favour the tactic of dragging said civilians directly into the line of fire with the specific purpose of getting them killed in order to fuel their propaganda machine. Oddly enough, some people insist on supporting Hizbollah nonetheless, and this is what puzzles me to no end…!
August 14th, 2006 at 4:05 pm
Mohamed -
You also shit where you eat, mate. But you do get some good points for occasionally trying to be funny
OK, now I’m really off.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:08 pm
OK, so I am not really really off.
Adam - well said, mate. This is also what puzzles me, in addition to why people who obviosly support HA claim that they don’t.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:11 pm
Twosret, Check out cyberlibel law, it might come in handy if you continue to be abused.
Lawyerwannabe
August 14th, 2006 at 4:16 pm
Lawyer - If I regularly choose to enter a private club where I get spat upon is that abuse or masochism?
August 14th, 2006 at 4:16 pm
“Sorry, but in my ears this reads: “hey, he hasn’t admitted to killing children, so he probably hasn’t. The mother on the other hand even admitted to killing her child!””
That is your interpretation in your own words, your ears or eyes in that matter read it differently but on different occasions, the accused Twosret in this case, has posted enough clarification to his/her intent which defies your ears/eyes.
In this case no blame can be put on him/her. There is a good virtue called benefit of the doubt, simple questions asked can avoid accusations, slander, abuse that is uncalled for.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:19 pm
“If I regularly choose to enter a private club where I get spat upon is that abuse or masochism?”
In the court of law slander is slander whether it is done in private club, church etc… and since this club is not private (public for all) then your arguement is not valid. On the contrary the suppression, abuse, illegal accusations, limited of freedom is illegal.
Lawyerwannabe
August 14th, 2006 at 4:19 pm
Dear Sandmonkey,
I think you been smokin a lil too much of that I wish I was American crack.
I agree, Kuntar is a piece of shit. He’s a murderer, and he pretty much is a disgrace to humans. But the reason he represents so much to the people of the south is not cuz arabs are islamic death lovin terrorists, but its cuz his release in one way or another liberates all the people that endured injustice just as bad only in those cases ofcourse those killers were DEFENDING their nation.
Why not go and ask the lebanese mothers wat the Isreali’s did when they invaded the South. Let them tell u bout the rapes, the killing and the most brutal tortures that kept on takin place in little villages for nearly two decades. Lets get recounts from the IAF pilots that unfortunately have a tendency to miss their targets and hit crowded civillian areas atleast twice a day(oh no wait its cuz of that damn human sheild strategy Hizbollah uses). Wats the difference between the babies that Kuntar killed and the hundreds of babies that are gettin burnt and burried alive day after day.
No type of killin is justifiable, its just a pitty and kind of pathetic how we have become so accustomed to arabs gettin brutaly killed that our blood tends to be a lot cheaper than that of others.
(and please i completely oppose the suicide killings just as much, but im just sayin if u think wat the kuntar fucker was bad, then lets look at wat happens on the other side. I didnt even get started bout the daily killin of children in Palestine.) BUT OFCOURSE, its all good when u playin that tight DEFENCE.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:21 pm
will samir kuntar ever be released? let’s consider is.
let’s suppose we recive a suggestion to trade samir for the two soldiers kidnaped by hizballa. I don’t see how this can pass by the israeli public opinion - we just went to war to release this two guys, so we’re not likley to accept a deal that we could have reached a month ago. so let’s suppose the suggestion also includes gilad shalit, which is held by hamas. that may just be enough to tip the balance. so let’s say this deal is accepted by israel, and maybe even by lebanon, but there’s no way the phalestinians will agree to give shalit without reciving any of their prisoners in return. they will most likely insist on the release of maruan barguti and the hamas parlament members, which again makes it a no-deal for israel.
so it’s in israel’s intrest not to connect those two cases together. another name that comes in mind, which is synonimous with “captivity” in israel is ron arad. if the hizballa offers a one-on-one deal, kuntar for arad, I’m sure it will be accepted. the only problem is, I personly don’t belive ron is alive, and he probably hasn’t been alive for many, many years.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:22 pm
Adam,
Sorry mate I didn’t know that asking you for what you had for breakfast is slander and abuse. I’m expecting to read you on the Twosret front to condemn the real slander to Twosret then if you think I’m abusing you.
On a lighter note you want go join a foursome?!
The Raccoon,
Today I respect you more for being RIGHT. Love that Fucking Gods comment.
Stay cool.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:28 pm
“In the court of law slander is slander whether it is done in private club, church etc… and since this club is not private (public for all) then your arguement is not valid. On the contrary the suppression, abuse, illegal accusations, limited of freedom is illegal.”
On the contrary - this club is private. SM maintains the site with his own personal funds. He allows us to comment freely but retains the right to censor that speech as he sees fit. SM can limit our ‘freedoms’ as he sees fit as long as we are in his domain. He is the state - his laws are the ones we follow. We are free to leave.
I concede the slander point.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:30 pm
94. Lawyerwannabe
That’s quite true, but since posting what she did would make no sense if this wasn’t her intention, I used common logic (no, I won’t discuss this - you can disagree as much as you want…).
The rest of her post left little doubt as to her opinion on the subject, unlike her later posts, where she seemed to have differing opinions depending on the immidiate question posed.
All in all a familiar feeling when discussing ME topics with anti-westeners… Opinions and quotes are upheld when it suits you and denied when it doesn’t. It seems the rest of the world can do nothing right and the arab/muslim world can do nothing wrong - insults and threats can be hurled one way with abandon, but if it comes back your way, it’s the worst of injustices. This makes for a very difficult basis for a reasonable discussion.
The way I see it, Twosret gave as good as she recieved, and considering her initial goal of minimizing the gravity of the crime of murdering a child, I’m sure where my sympathy lies…
August 14th, 2006 at 4:32 pm
“This makes for a very difficult basis for a reasonable discussion.”
I come here for the free popcorn
August 14th, 2006 at 4:33 pm
Dan,
You are unaware of the law and speaks from a non-professional stance, I recommend you contact your lawyer and discuss, internet harassement, threats, and slander.
only then you will be able to evaluate the situation here from a legal point of view.
LWB
August 14th, 2006 at 4:34 pm
To some guy who replied to me:
Samir Kuntar mission was to kill the nuclear scientist . He had no intention of killing the child, she stood in his way so he had to get rid of her. Thats what some might call collateral damage.
I will give you an analogy maybe you can better understand.
Few weeks before the Kidnapping in Gaza, Israel launched a 1/2 ton bomb on the house of a Hamas militant who was sleeping with his family of seven. He was killed instantly along with his family and 2 bystanders.
Offcourse, the aim of the mission was to target the Hamas dude but not his family, they just happened to sleep with him in the same house. Their death was what Israelis call collateral damage.
Now can someone explain to me what’s the difference between both scenarios? Please help me understand the mind of a typical Israeli.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:35 pm
“You are unaware of the law and speaks from a non-professional stance, I recommend you contact your lawyer and discuss, internet harassement, threats, and slander.
only then you will be able to evaluate the situation here from a legal point of view. ”
I recommend the free popcorn.
I was just trying to be as off-topic as everyone else …
August 14th, 2006 at 4:39 pm
98. Mohamed
Insinuating that I write rubbish because I don’t eat is certainly not very polite.
However, it was more the “Don’t they feed you there?” part that ired me… Just for your info, I’m not in some kind of institution where I have to rely on others for my food.
Unless of course you too imply something other than the obvious…?
August 14th, 2006 at 4:42 pm
“# Dan Irving Says:
August 14th, 2006 at 4:32 pm
“This makes for a very difficult basis for a reasonable discussion.”
I come here for the free popcorn”
Hahahaha!!!!
Great!
Down to earth again - good one!
August 14th, 2006 at 4:47 pm
Don’t they feed you there? is a slang to refer to someone who is on the edge. Not a slander, not an insult, not to insinuate that you rely on others for your food.
I never insinuated that you write rubbish, what did you have for breakfast? is like you woke up on the wrong side of the bed. you see, this is where miscommunication happens and it leads to false accusations to people.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:48 pm
Oh Adam so you laugh and have some sense of humor then
what do you think of my offer for a foursome? too shy aren’t we?! 
August 14th, 2006 at 4:50 pm
107. Mohamed
Right, your slang makes absolutely no sense, but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and apologize if I have misunderstood you…
August 14th, 2006 at 4:52 pm
Adam,
You are confusing me for Thinker, but I replied to follow your logic. Thinker owe you a response too, me thinks.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:55 pm
Hey man don’t even apologize, I was trying to explain and I’m not offended. Just take it easy on Twosret, she is not bad at all, take my word for it. I’m not sure where you write from but some slang comments might not make sense to you.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:56 pm
Just to be clear …
If I ever say Naj te koklja brcne to anyone … it can be taken as an insult.
… or slander if you are deathly afraid of chickens.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:56 pm
Hey, YOU described the logic behind… It made no sense , so I responded to you. The same goes for Thinker too, if you two agree on the same meaning… :o)
August 14th, 2006 at 4:57 pm
Mohamed,
Here are some things for you to consider. I did not tell you where I live and you should not have that information nor make it public. Only I should have that right. You are not a friend of mine and I find you angry and intimidating. Telling me that you will COME VISIT ME and that you are WATCHING ME are threats whether you mean them to be or not. It is not for me to figure out. They are things that should not be said. Lastly, Two does not need you to defend her. She can dish is out, but she can’t take it. She also uses names like idiot, hypocrite and stupid when debating people. Anyways, you have crossed a line that I would have never crossed. You should think before you type.
August 14th, 2006 at 4:58 pm
Hmm… odd smiley. Maybe this works better?
August 14th, 2006 at 4:58 pm
Dan don’t play a smart ass to defuse the situation
August 14th, 2006 at 4:58 pm
Born-as-a-SHI3I -
Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit and some more bullshit. Did I mention that it’s all bullshit except for Kuntar being a monster?
I have served in Lebanon for a year (1999-2000, based in Marjayoun), and I know for a fact that your description is a total and utter lie. There was torture of captive Hizbollah terrorists in Khiam prison - by SLA.
Your attempt to defend Hizballah by moral equivalence - using utterly spurious claims, at that - is reprehensible in the extreme. I could analyze it from here till Easter - and it wouldn’t change the fact that you’re defending despicable individuals and acts by despicable means.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:02 pm
Hey, Born. How was your trip? Glad to see you weren’t massacred (as was your worry when you left).
Here’s what confuses me…why do you WANT kuntar back? He is proud of smashing the little girl’s skull in. If I were an Arab (let alone Israeli), I wouldn’t want that kind of monster living near me and my kids. I mean, if he had expressed remorse for so brutally killing a small child in an attempt to do his “freedom fighting” or whatever then he may be viewed differently. Clearly this guy is prone to homocidal rage - just outside of the Arab/Israeli conflict.
“Let them tell u bout the rapes, the killing and the most brutal tortures that kept on takin place in little villages for nearly two decades.”
Look, if that happened then each of those soldiers should be court marshalled. Period. The American soldiers who are being court marshalled right now for the rape and killing in Hamida (I think it’s Hamida, anyway) will likely never see the light of day because - unlike the civilian court - there is no presumption of innocense. But we solve those grievances with court trials of the accused - not by letting a convicted brutal killer loose on society (be it Israeli or Lebanese).
“Wats the difference between the babies that Kuntar killed and the hundreds of babies that are gettin burnt and burried alive day after day.”
The difference is that one is intentional and one is not. It takes a special kind of beast to commit the crime (and then BRAG about it) that Kuntar committed. Kuntar stood trial and was convicted for his own actions - he does not represent Arabs as a whole. Thus, his release does not avenge Arabs. He would just be a danger to Arab society, IMO.
Also, you forgot to mention that Hezbollay picked this fight. And also forgot to mention that Hezbollah didn’t build a single bomb shelter. Why aren’t you holding them at least equally accountable? And how is getting Kuntar back worth it? Why not allow the Lebanese government to negotiate prisoners and sheba farms, etc. ?
August 14th, 2006 at 5:06 pm
Stan - the man was not trying to kill a nuclear scientist. He took a little girl and her father, made her watch as he kill him and then smashed the little girl’s skull. This is not collateral damage - this is premediated murder of the worst possible kind.
But you don’t see it, do you? You really are so blinded by false moral equivalence that you have no more sense of right and wrong…
I pity you, O casualty of psychotic academia.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:07 pm
Racoon, I love you guy !
Twosret is one of my favorites, she is emotive and sensible, feels the unseen things, her discourse may sometimes happen a bit exagerated, but she always take the intelligent part of the things, sorry for the others, but some may say it is the bastard french way, I don’t care, it is the way we are !
August 14th, 2006 at 5:09 pm
Hey Racooon…
first of all u were in marjeyoun…christians in the war were not really fucked with
Im from khiam…since the invasion started
so dont give me ur shit when u came in the last two years and just stood around and did nothin
man even if im makin shit up
just watch tv
how the fuck can a country be defending an occupation
look at wat happens in palestine everyday…how do u justify kickin people out of their houses and then destroyin them..oh ya..its cuz they dont have permits from the isreali gov to build a house on their own land…people in palestine get water for two hours a week while close by settlements got pools….and thats in their own land..no one is arguin that Isreal doesnt deserve to exist..
but enough with the real BULLSHIT bout isreal bein the poor victim
dammnn u guys r livin in ur own little bubble
August 14th, 2006 at 5:13 pm
Mohamed,
“I never insinuated that you write rubbish, what did you have for breakfast? is like you woke up on the wrong side of the bed. you see, this is where miscommunication happens and it leads to false accusations to people.”
eh, Mohamed are you really being genuine? I mean there’s the connotative and the denotative meaning. I mean, I would never call my sainted mother-in-law “hameti” because that would be a giant insult - although the word denotatively means something completely innocuous: “mother-in-law”. So are you genuinely sorry for the perceived insult or are you using those rich arabic sayings which have such rich double meanings to get yourself off the hook while the Arabic speakers really know what you’re saying?
hmmmm…..???
August 14th, 2006 at 5:18 pm
Kiki darling, me sad, sad, sad you don’t love me anymore! Get Twosret out of your head and don’t target her, leave her alone, don’t follow her so you don’t inspire others to put you in your place.
When you were verbally raped by an Egyptian guy, she stood by you and gave the guy hell for you, she defended you. You continue to harass her, even after she posted that she won’t comment on your posts, she shared with you like a friend some of her very valuable information (children, cooking, funny moments) like you did, talked about food, life, kindness, and put aside differences. You two set a great example.
You owe her one, she never attacked you back and did prefer silence. Have some honor and dignity for that and stop your personal attacks on her and act with dignity like she did with you before. Ganging up on her with abusers is very bad.
Again, don’t panic no need to worry I don’t have any intention to know you, visit you or even watch you, those were jokes and nothing serious keep your panties on. calling someone an idiot or hypocrite is different from accusing one being a terrorist and rape her verbally.
So, does that mean you turn down the offer of the threesome? me more sad, sad, sad, sad.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:25 pm
Born…
your quote: “no one is arguin that Isreal doesnt deserve to exist..”
See, that’s just it. You aren’t. But you’re not armed. Hamas and Hezbollah don’t agree with you and they ARE armed.
your quote: “look at wat happens in palestine everyday…how do u justify kickin people out of their houses and then destroyin them..oh ya..its cuz they dont have permits from the isreali gov to build a house on their own land…people in palestine get water for two hours a week while close by settlements got pools….and thats in their own land..”
See, I tend to strongly agree with you there. I don’t think Isreal should be occupying there at all. I don’t think the settlements belong there.
The only problem is that Hamas and HA continually distract everybody with the right to exist issue. How can you (”you” = Hamas & HA supporters) ask a country which you are determined to “push into the ocean” to be kinder to you? How can you demand respect and dignity from people whom you are trying to murder?
Shouldn’t the Palestinians and HA supporters first determine that Israel is a country and it has the right to exist and THEN demand it behave more honourably?
just to be clear: I’m not trying to get into a fist fight with you here. These are practical questions.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:27 pm
Born -
Amusingly, I now understand your position. “just watch tv”. If you’re getting your news from Al-Manar and Al-Jazeera, it’s little wonder you believe that Israel is evil and so on and so forth.
Guess what - I’ve been around most of South Lebanon and I know what I’m talking about. I didn’t watch it on the telly - I saw it with my own eyes or heard it from my mates and relatives who’ve seen it with their own eyes.
After Lebanon I served in the Territories, as did my mates and relatives. And let me tell you a little secret, brother - telly lies. Especially Arab telly.
But I am tired of refuting the same bullshit over and over again; the info is out there if you really care. But it’s so much more comfortable to believe the telly, innit, brother?
August 14th, 2006 at 5:30 pm
anonon, Go away ya helwa
An abuser like you are trying to examine my genuine self?
When you hang around here longer you will know that people here might throw some jokes around, have a feisty exchanges but in no way we like to abuse, slander, terrorise each other.
An apology to Twosret might give you a good passport in our little community.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:32 pm
Please Mo, do not revise history. Two gives as good as she gets. And she did not defend me for the abuse I received. There was a big BUT in there and that but was that I deserved it. And as you can see I am not the only one she pisses off. O.k.? Now I will tell you something else. A couple of months ago someone revealed something about a family member of Two’s that made her go ballistic. It was personal information. I saw it, but I didn’t repeat it, even when angry. Why? because I am a decent human being and I realize that there are somethings that you do not use against a person to hurt them (unlike you). Lastly, don’t blame me for your anger. It is yours and I didn’t cause it. Own it and then maybe you can deal with your attiturde that others make you angry.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:33 pm
Can someone get us some neutral report describing the events on the day of the operation. For all I know, the whole story of crushing the girl’s head against a rock could be some urban myth to picture the guy as a monster.
One thing I learned over the yeras, never trust a Zionist.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:33 pm
BTW, Mohamed - threesome is uncomfortable. Tried that once, can’t see why people get so excited about it. It’s also pretty disgusting - I mean, sex is a very private thing.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:34 pm
“let me tell you a little secret, brother - telly lies.”
to that end….
http://www.powerlineblog.com/powerlinenews/video2/
click on “pallywood”
August 14th, 2006 at 5:35 pm
Ballout - very healthy attitude there. You’re on the right way to 72 raisins!
*spits*
August 14th, 2006 at 5:39 pm
This comment is for you Mo and for the other commentators here. I want to know how you found out which city I live in since I never mentioned it. The only way that I know of for you to find it out is through the SandMonkey. He is the only one who has access to my email and that kind of personal information. And if he shared that with you (and I suspect Two from something she said to me in the past) than that is very unethical and hypocritical. If he should have the freedom to make his opinions know from the safety of anonimity than so should his commentators. He wants to live free of threats and so do I and I’m sure the other posters here feel similarly. So please do tell us if that is how you found out where I live?!
August 14th, 2006 at 5:39 pm
no, Mo Mo. I don’t want a passport to your little community. In your little community you get to dish it out but you won’t eat your own cooking.
In your little community you get to attack and belittle victims of terrorist attacks but no one gets to attack you back.
In your little world, you have no shame. Brutal killers are only brutal killers if they kill your child - never someone elses.
I believe the world left your little world’s “logic” several centuries ago.
The civilized world doesn’t want a passport to your little world.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:47 pm
You are wrong Karen and tend on every occasion to deny facts. If you insist I will revive history to show your false accusations and your intended memory loss. Twosret holds a very special place to many members of the blogsphere. I’m proud of her zeal, courage, creative self to uphold her beliefs despite the many disagreements and abuse she recieves, she is one of the rare arabs that posts to encourage co-existance of Palestinians and Israelis, one of the rare to engage and make friends of some zionists that are extreme in their thoughts and prefers to refer to them as humans vs. enemies.
We are not perfect and Twosret is not perfect and I might disagree with her thoughts but to try to intimidate someone innocent and rejoice and encourage abuse is a shameful act on your part. Raccoon is the example you should follow.
The piece of information posted on Twosret were deleted by Sandmonkey due to abuse, that is why you don’t bring it up. You call on Craig who abused and harassed Twosret many times like anonon, what does that make you? Angry, bitter and ungrateful Karen. Not the Kiki I thought I knew. I tease you and distract you because I thought you have a nice side to you. So don’t be angry, bitter, and revengeful because it ain’t healthy for your soul.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:52 pm
KiKi,
Don’t drag Sandmonkey and Twosret to this, I have never contacted Sandmonkey or Twosret on a personal level, my post was a pure guess and a joke that you confirmed, I live on the American side of Vancouver so my first thought jokingly I posted was the Canadian side.
Easy does it baby.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:58 pm
I didn’t know it was deleted. I just knew it bothered her. That is why I didn’t bring it up. And as for Craig, he was brilliant. His arguments were articulate and based in fact not the latest google search (or links to kkk members or Jean Marie Le Pen). And he probably left this board becuase it is not a safe place to have a discussion. And if Two argues with everyone, well what is the common denominator Mo?
I have a very nice side to me. But when she slanders my people, she slanders me. O.k.? She claims to not support the terrorists. But quite often she says what they say. You and I will never agree because we come from different backgrounds and perspectives and we have our own biases and experiences. I am just very disappointed. That is all.
August 14th, 2006 at 5:59 pm
This is becoming funny, so out of the 4 million something people lives there, you bring out a perfect conspiracy theory Karen?
August 14th, 2006 at 6:00 pm
#135 I don’t believe you. You aren’t that lucky. Ever thought of going to Las Vegas?
August 14th, 2006 at 6:09 pm
#21 shiver me timbers. Child Protective Services doesn’t deal in parents who simply are willfully clueless. Slander? Threats? Yeah, Twosret did that to my by impuning slander when there was none, and by an implied threat never to speak to her again.
Whatever. Not gonna get my panties in a bunch over that.
But you are right Lala, Twosret is emblamatic of the problem. She is the poster child for the problem. One for which there is frankly no solution. C’est la vie.
You can lead a horse to water, you just cannot make them drink. And you are right Lala, the fellow with the automatic weapon in the mosque in 1994 was wrong. That was evil. Notice the lack of equivocation, the lack of dissimulation. This is called being straight, frank, and honest. I do not believe it is possible for one of the sides in this conflict to ever be straight, frank, or honest, apart from small patches such as SM. Until SM’s mindset skepticism and pragmatism rule the roost, “moderates” like Twosret are going to be offering their “alternative narratives”.
I can’t wait for the alternative narrative on the holocaust. I know there are many running round the arab world. Some are laughable, some are maddening, all of them point up to a problem we in the rest of the world would be foolish to ignore. That the de-nazification programs that were performed in Germany in the late 40’s are miniscule compared to the de-programming job ahead for the arab world. I am not sure the world is up to it. But address it we must, because we see what happens when their self-inflicted sores fester and metastisize. We pay the price for their ignorance.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:10 pm
Karen - you’re being paranoid, methinks. Moreover, I do not understand the goal of this debate or its usefulness.
If you want to stop our people from being slandered, convince them; or laugh at them; do so online or by starting a PR firm or joining an existing one.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:14 pm
The debate is done Raccoon and as for me being paranoid go back and read and see if I have (had) a reason.
Maybe I need a vacation from this board like the one you took?!
August 14th, 2006 at 6:15 pm
Kranky - well said. But this problem is indeed impossible to solve by conventional means; moreover, it is the face on a whole different and larger problem. Which is why the world is heading at full speed towards a slaughter hithero unknown in scope.
The only questions remaining is in which form this slaughter will take form and who will be the survivors.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:16 pm
You also slander her people in your comments karen, so why does she maintain self control and you don’t?, Twosret arguments are only because many Egyptians and arabs have given up on posting on a blog flooded by Israelis and extreme zionists. As wishbone rightly said before, she maintains her position and should never be silenced. She pisses off people like you and others because she is a one rare voice on this forum. Want to count how many Israelis are here? and how many arabs?
Did anyone tell you before that you have a sneaky attitude Karen?, sometimes falls into a cunning category? Do you see any faults in your behavior or you are a pro at pointing others out?. Many arguements presented by Twosret is valid and true, the KKK link you refer to was posted on an article that refers to no hate, an article that anyone who wouldn’t know who the author is other than a PHD holder and a Lousiana representative of the Gov. in the United States of America as an analysis to some control of Jews to the media. Towsret took back the article and disagreed, once she knew who David is.
In return what do you do? you come here to post it on a different link to make her sound really bad. Do you see how you can portray yourself as Mo. said ungrateful, bitter, angry and cunning.
My 2 cents are exhausted off to lunch.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:20 pm
Mo., you beat me to it, sounds like we are on the same wave length, glad I found someone who can read more than hate. Good Job. Bravo man!
August 14th, 2006 at 6:21 pm
No vacation for you KiKi until I say so.
love you sweets 
August 14th, 2006 at 6:21 pm
Whatever, I don’t care about your knight in shining armour-Two. I am sick of talking about her. I see her as being the same way you describe me. I won’t bring her up again o.k.? But that doesn’t mean she won’t be arguing with others because that is what she does. Go enjoy your lunch and do some more thinking.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:23 pm
#59 Alaa Says:
Work with me on this Alaa, say it slowly.
“Killing any children for any reason, is wrong.” It is a crime in most cases, and if done purposefully, that is, in order to kill the children, and not for any military objective, then it is called a war crime.
Then go and look at some of those posted links.
As evil if not worse is purposefully drawing fire against children, by placing military materiel next to, on top of, underneath children and civilians. Thats called a war crime.
I see Hezb down with two serious actionable matters. Hamas with the same set.
Now I am gonna say this real slow, so there is no possible misunderstanding.
If, and I repeat if, Israeli soldiers purposefully targeted civilians, for no militarily valid reason, then they have committed a crime, and possibly a war crime. I would be hard pressed to imagine that they have done this. But if they have, those responsible should be hauled into court.
No equivocation. No dissimulation. Would you do the same Alaa? I think you may actually agree on this. And that is the basis for something to grow with.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:24 pm
Anyways, I got lots to do. Go find someone else to fight with. I’m tired of it. I think I am going to stick to my other blogs from now on. Too many extemists from the other side here. Enjoy talking to yourselves.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:26 pm
Nadav - The price for Samir Kuntar’s release has long been known, and it is indeed solid information leading to the wherabouts and/or fate of Ron Arad. Hizb’Allah has known this is his stated price since 2004. The Kuntar family even tried to help gather information on Arad’s fate. I’m even willing to believe Nasrallah that maybe - maybe - he really doesn’t know where Arad is or what happennd to him - but for fuck’s sake, SOMEONE in the Shiite community in Lebanon surely does.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:28 pm
Karen - my point is that there is no point in taking offense even if you’re being offended. It just doesn’t serve an interest of any sort.
Moreover, commenting on blogs is a not a job - hence, you can’t take a vacation from it. It’s somethat that we all do or do not for our own personal reasons.
About extremists here - actually, compared to most Arab/Muslim blogs, the Arab/Muslim commenters here are nice, cuddly and have halos. The chief exception is eee, but it’s long been established to be an escaped mental patient and not, in fact, an Arab and/or Muslim.
PS.
Hope I didn’t summon eee by mentioning its name.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:30 pm
Oh dear. Not fun here again today?
Say, how about if we all do role reversals? Take the opposite side - do research. If you’re pro-Israeli, study the Palestinian issue. If you are not, study the Israeli side of things. If nothing else, it would broaden all of our horizons. Isn’t that what Sandmonkey wants for this blog?
(Or else, just tell me to shut up and come back another time. Hi, Twosret!)
August 14th, 2006 at 6:31 pm
Shay,
I don’t get it. Why on earth would you ever foist Kuntar on society again - for any price?
August 14th, 2006 at 6:32 pm
(Psst, The Raccoon - you know what happened last time!)
August 14th, 2006 at 6:39 pm
Amazing Story of Samir Kuntar!
Thankyou for an “alternative” view! But I am curious: As none of the terrorists escaped that day, exactly how was this thrilling narrative created? And SIX SQUADRONS of warships? My my, does Israel HAVE that many? Am I wrong to suspect perhaps a little embellishment? But, someone said that between the extremes of two sides lies the truth- and to that end, I shall supply another alternative:
Samir and the Golden Horde landed in Israel, although half of their six thousand man invasion force fled in panic after mistaking a lost shrimp trawler for an Israeli warship. Sadly, these heros became lost and drowned, and so the actual story was never told. But the rest of the force was soon trapped on the beach, depleted and exhausted, for Israeli children equipped with small plastic shovels and buckets had lined the beaches with obstacles of sand, some of which were over 12 inches tall.
Samir and his men launched into a furious attack on the children, only to sustain heavy losses. One by one, they fell to expertly wielded toys. With only a few survivors by his side, Samir used Black Magic to invoke the Powers of Darkness, summoning several minor demons, a legion of the Undead, a dozen orcs, a balrog, seven klingons, Tammy Baker’s cosmetician and Enron’s legal counsel to his aide.
Still these were not enough. Bright Isreali sunlight proved too much for the Undead- and, not surprisingly, the lawyers. The Cosmetician worked heroically, and numerous terrorists went to their waiting virgins sporting thick layers of mascara and rouge. The Balrog was spotted by an Israeli basketball coach and given a four year contract. Samir managed to kill only a policeman, an Israeli civilian, and a dangerous little girl who had single handedly managed to wipe out his orcs an klingons. Using the last of his strength to strike down the little girl, Samir vowed not to be taken alive but was struck from behind by a well thrown cherry popsicle, and knocked unconscious.
There now. We have two narratives, and since we have actual evidence on neither, we must regard both as equally legitimate. Somewhere in between, I suspect, lies reality.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:42 pm
143. Thinker
Just to point it out…
I’m neither Israeli or a zionist. I’m european, and I’m viewing this (relatively) from the sidelines. Although the anti-Israeli are very outspoken in the west, it just so happens that alot of us find ourselves sympathysing with the Israelis (despite their faults) and resenting the arabs (despite their hardships).
A recent poll showed that 58 % of my countrymen felt that Lebanon itself was to blame for this conflict for not cracking down on Hizbollah, while only 21 % felt that Israel bore the blame.
Although this tendency is partly due to generally negative experiences with arab/muslim immigrants in our own countries and our own bad treatment of jews in the past, it has more to do with the general mindset of the two parties in this conflict. To put it short, the arab/muslim way of thinking is so foreign and so old-fashioned that it does not evoke any empathy in us.
The (almost) complete lack of logic, justice and sense of consequence that we see in the arguments (and lack of same) coming from the arab/muslim world amazes and alienates us to no end, and I fear that this will not change untill the arab/muslim world (and I’m generalizing here, I know…) ‘grow up’ and start looking at their own faults some of the time as well.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:44 pm
Ben - LOL!
Thanks, mate, you made me laugh. I needed that
August 14th, 2006 at 6:44 pm
Ben…
Thank you for uncovering the true story of Samir Kuntar. I nearly wet myself laughing.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:46 pm
I’m not getting into this fight, but a few things.
One: The Harans had two children. One - Yael - died hiding with her mother, smothered as her mother tried to keep her from screaming (which would have meant their death). The other - Einat - was dragged outside by Quntar, along with her father, Danny. Quntar then shot Danny in front of Einat’s eyes, and followed that up by bashing Einat’s head against a rock with the butt of his rifle.
Two: Twos, if you’re wondering why people think you might be defending Quntar, reread your first post: “So between SM Israeli side of the story and this bio, we can conclude something in-between maybe?” There is no “in between” - Quntar did what he did, and admitted it. Even the site you posted doesn’t deny it - just lauds him as a hero for it.
Three: Stan, if you can’t understand why grabbing a child, dragging her outside along with the “primary target” and killing her after the “primary target” doesn’t equate to “colateral damage” (i.e. unintentional deaths that were unavoidable and necessary to completing the primary objective) then you are not in possession of a working brain. From the quality of your writing it seems that you are in possession of a working brain. My conclusion is that you either have not actually been using it, or you are simply being intellectually dishonest. I’m not sure I care which.
August 14th, 2006 at 6:47 pm
Ben, sort of like Odysseus gone pop! I love it!
August 14th, 2006 at 7:01 pm
Once again, to those who scream about Palestinian children being slaughtered by the IDF: watch the fucking telly. But not Al-Jazeera or Al-Manar bs. Watch this - > http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=22061&only
And if at the end of it you keep on rewinding the “brainwash” tape that runs non-stop in your heads, then you are a lost cause. The Arab media lies (and is untrustworthy) because they learnt their journalism classes with Joseph Goebells (and to a smaller extent with William Randolph Hearst). Israel is a democracy that has a free media, thus anyone SANE is more likely to believe Israeli media (or MEMRI, for that matter) than the bullshit that airs on daily in Arab channels.
In Egypt (or was it Syria?) there was recently a soap opera whose main plot was based on the Protocols of the Elders of Zion (XIX century anti-semitic czarist propaganda). As to news… just press the fucking LGF link I provided.
August 14th, 2006 at 7:47 pm
Hey, SM! Bush is giving Syria a good ole walloping on CNN right now - that should be water on your mill, eh?!
Not that I agree with Bush most of the time, but in this case I won’t say a bad word about the man… Let’s see if the rest of the world will take the cue?
August 14th, 2006 at 8:09 pm
Damn it Ben, now I am laughing … This is not supposed to be funny….
balrog… orcs…. well aimed popsicle stick … ok back to work. No more of this … /snicker
August 14th, 2006 at 8:32 pm
I’d give them Samir Kuntar back. On a cold slab. Missing a few body parts.
August 14th, 2006 at 8:39 pm
Twosret, that site also calles Naharia, that was founded at 1935, as “settlement”.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:00 pm
alex,
LGF is the Al-Jazeera of bloggers, it is pathetic man, can’t you come up with some better links that deserves respect. A one sided mania is reliable source.
Avika,
Don’t penalize someone who is trying to read more on the topic, you are reading what you want and disregarding other comments by Twosret for the sake of all the fucking God’s grow up and stretch your brain a bit.
The Raccoon,
Swinging might work better for you then
Where is Twosret? get her back here? will ya? did you see the picture she posted for both you man! that was hilarious, LMAO looking at both of you in harmony.
let me find the link. You are a lucky bastard a hard core zionist and she likes you that much
August 14th, 2006 at 9:02 pm
Noa,
Why should this surprise you since twosret is reporting from “occupied palestine”?
August 14th, 2006 at 9:14 pm
Mohammed,
I didn’t say anything at all rude to Twosret, or demeaning, or in any way disregarding other comments by her. I noticed that she seemed to be confusing the child who died in hiding with the child Quntar killed by bashing her head against a rock with the butt of his rifle, and pointed out that they were actually two different children.
I also pointed out that she said something that many of the people responding to her took as “defending” Quntar - the statement that the “truth” was possibly somewhere in between the Quntarites “he’s a hero” and the rest of the world’s “he’s a child murdering psycopath.” That statement was simply false; the truth is, he is a child murdering psychopath. Period.
I understand that you like Twosret and have appointed yourself her knight-in-shining-armor-defender-who-responds-to-unwarranted-attacks.
What I don’t understand is why you have your lance pointed at me.
So, “for the sake of all f’ing God’s” maybe you could breathe a bit before you call me out for the next imagined slight?
August 14th, 2006 at 9:22 pm
trade this guy? fuck that shit, execute him now.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:23 pm
Avika,
I misunderstood you then and I’m sorry ( makes it hard to see positive intent after 900 trolls) , I don’t usually defend Twosret, check out previous topics, I do today because I think she has been viciously attacked.
peace out.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:32 pm
“I don’t usually defend Twosret, check out previous topics, I do today because I think she has been viciously attacked.”
read the posts mohamed. I’m assuming you mean twosret was attacked in post #75?
Read post #62 and then Twosret’s response in post #71, where Twos was attacking that person’s IQ and belittling her and her husband, calling them idiots and hypocrites as well as their experience during 9/11 which she clearly knew nothing about.
It looks to me like twosret was the one who attacked.
Of course….you seem to have selective memory anyway.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:35 pm
The demand for Samir Kuntar is not a legitimate negotiating point. It is an intentional provocaction, and carries the message that, in the eyes of some people, the lives of Jewish people have no value. Decent countries do not make such demands. A decent country would let him rot in a foreign jail.
August 14th, 2006 at 9:39 pm
Faith,
I read everything you don’t need to redirect me to posts, again HUGE difference between calling someone an idiot or hypocrite and call someone a terrorist , bring her family, dead and alive into a discussion to enforce vicious low attacks.
Many bloggers agrees with what I think of Twosret so as she says “if you don’t like it there is an option to scroll down”
August 14th, 2006 at 10:15 pm
#168 d00d: trade this guy? fuck that shit, execute him now.
My sentiments exactly. In this country (the US), that’s exactly what we would do (or at least let him rot in prison for the rest of his hateful life, which would probably end at the hands of other violent criminals, who generally despise child murderers).
I guess for his apologists, if you have the right politics, anything goes. Anyone who defends Kuntar is deplorable.
August 14th, 2006 at 10:15 pm
Twosret Says:
August 13th, 2006 at 11:17 pm
A quick search on Samir Kuntar came up with the following:-
http://www.samirkuntar.org/files/About_Samir_Kuntar.htm
So between SM Israeli side of the story and this bio, we can conclude something in-between maybe?
********************************************************
No I read you link, they are singularly silent on their activities
“The group burst into a high building (number 61) in Jabootinski where they parted into two groups.
The battle that ended the operation took place when Kuntar tried to get closer to his boat at the seashore”
Big gap their IMO the DETAILS OF THE “Nasser’s Operation”: has a gaping hole in it.
Anyone who wants to support this bloodthirsty child murdering monster should at least be up front about it. Instead of trying to pass that pathetic bilge off as an example of antoher viewpoint
August 14th, 2006 at 10:19 pm
Mohamed,
Personal note; I’m always intrigued by women with brain and passion, mental stimulation is a turn on and Twosret did it for me. Therfore, I understand why would you defend her. Go getter is the way. I’m not fond of politics in this part of the world but appreciate a tiggress with a sense of humor and love to wine and dine.
August 14th, 2006 at 10:24 pm
“but what many of you are saying is that if you crush a childs skull with a cluster bomb dropped from an F-16 then that’s completely kosher, but if you do it with a rifle butt then you’re a child-murderer? I guess the cluster bomb was aimed at the whole apartment block not at the child…” Alaa
That _is_ what many people are saying here, or at least that the moral responsbility for killing a child with a cluster bomb is entirely Hizbollah’s. Then there are others who say that there is no moral equivalence between the two, because one is a deliberate, premeditated, intentionally cruel act. They are correct about this, but I don’t think Alaa was trying to claim any moral equivalency. There’s another position being ignored here - that these are both crimes, but one is worse than the other. Murder versus manslaughter.
So is it a crime to kill a child in an aerial bombing raid? Yes, if it was avoidable. It was unavoidable if this war was necessary and if there was no other way to conduct this war. Was it possible to conduct the war with only a ground assault? It would have been extremely difficult. It would have cost the lives of many, many Israeli soldiers. Many Israeli teenage conscripts. They didn’t choose to be in the front line but the Israeli government took that decision. Did they have any choice? Is it possible for Israel to have a viable army without conscription?
I’m not going to pretend to have answers to those questions. They are incredibly hard moral judgements for any government to make. So was it a crime to kill children in air raids? I don’t know. But don’t treat it as if it is nothing, or as if Israel has no need to ask itself any questions.
August 14th, 2006 at 10:26 pm
No type of killin [sic] is justifiable, its just a pitty and kind of pathetic how we have become so accustomed to arabs gettin brutaly killed that our blood tends to be a lot cheaper than that of others.
I have just read it all. This from the culture that lauds suicide-bombers as an ends-to-a-means and says nothing when its own are slaughtered in the thousands. Whose moral code affirms torture, misyogny and worse. Oh, praise be to Alllah! Another example of complete victimhood. I am so sick of muslims behaving badly. What utter and complete hypocrisy. Simply beyond reason….
August 14th, 2006 at 10:30 pm
Lawyerwannabe,
Right on the money man! and the bastard Raccoon gets all the praise :). Talking about The Raccoon, I know your style might be copyright but I would like to use the same tactic on Dan Kuffman the way you use it on eee.
So Dan Kauffman after all the explanation and what is said you come and post this then my reply to you.
“I ask you to open your right eye so I can pee in your socket.” Thanks to The Raccoon
August 14th, 2006 at 10:30 pm
Anonymous Leb,
But if releasing him means less Israeli and Lebanese children will die then what kind of justice is it we insist that he stays in jail EVEN if that means more children will die
Wrong. more people will die. Releasing prisoners will encourage Hezbollah that its attacks do pay dividends and encourage future attacks by emboldening terrorists to act again and again.
The kidnapping of the two Israeli soldiers (and the one in Gaza) this time around is a direct result of previous prisoner exchanges. Several soldiers were killed in the prcoess of these abductions. Those dead soldiers cannot be saved - they have already paid the ultimate price for shortsighted appeasement by previous Israeli administrations.
The policy towards terrorists should be to exterminate them. An imprisoned terrorist can be the object of future terrorist attacks - a dead terrorist cannot.
Frankly, if you are concerned about the deaths of Lebanese children then maybe you ninnies in Lebanon ought to get serious about disarming Hezbollah.
While I think Israeli made a whole series of mistakes in this operation, I was encouraged by something I saw: Gillerman was on Fox today and said that this was Lebanon’s “last chance.”
I can sort of understand the thinking going on here: if Hezbollah can be weakened by Israel, which it has in the past few weeks, this should give the Lebanese central government an opportunity to contest Hezbollah’s authority in the country. A strong central government with a monopoly on the use of force would be the best outcome for Lebanon and its neighbors. But if the Lebanese government fails to act, then Israel will be fully empowered to do whatever it needs to do - even if that risks sending Lebanon spiraling into civil war.
Since Arabs rarely miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity and since Siniora is clearly what the “Ahnold” the Governator would call a “girly-man” - I think Lebanon is doomed.
Too bad.
August 14th, 2006 at 10:47 pm
MidEast War: 102
War News (Blogs & Opinion below) Covered: News: Devil in the Details; Israeli Assault; Coming Attractions; Ceasefire Resolution Passed. Blogs: Why Display the Dead?; Olmert’s Great Achievement; Many Weapons, No Food. [To read entire post click Mor…
August 14th, 2006 at 10:53 pm
From the “Free Samir Kuntar” website, the link to which was posted here earlier:
“He demanded to eliminate a previous resolution stipulated by the Israeli cabinet, which said no execution should be implemented against gorilla fighters as the international law prohibits it.”
That probably explains it. If Kuntar was really a mountain gorilla, the people supporting his release aren’t terrorist lovers, they are simply hardcore environmentalists.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:29 pm
Mohamed,
I’m seeing a disturbing pattern here. You defend one for doing the same thing as the other.
You said that the other poster brought Twosret’s family into it “dead and alive”. But I believe Twosret was the first to bring the other poster’s family into it. Twosret also made some snarky, offensive and clearly innacurate comments about the other poster’s experience on 9/11. I really don’t see how she had any right to do that. How did tworet know that the other poster didn’t lose a brother in 9/11, for example. I think that if you’re going to be inflamatory and incensitive, you better prepare to be flamed.
don’t see anything about calling her a terrorist. True, the other poster should have probably just ignored such stupid comments from twosret because, as my grandma always said, “don’t argue with idiots. Passersby will have trouble figuring out which is which”.
Whatever.
Good blog, though. Interesting read. Glad I stopped by.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:40 pm
Faith, the anonon troll is offensive so glad you stopped by and please come and visit us here again.
Yours truly,
Mo.
August 15th, 2006 at 12:30 am
Nazrallah didn’t take thousands of Lebanese citizens as human shield hostages for the sake of Samir Kuntar’s release. He used Samir Kuntar as a pretext for doing Damascus’s and Iran’s bidding. While Israel holds three Lebanese prisoners, including the psychopathic murderer, Kuntar, Syria holds thousands of Lebanese and Syrian prisoners of conscience who don’t have blood on their hands, and the Iranian regime holds many thousands more. And he didn’t do it for Sha’baa Farms, which the UN holds is Syrian territory, but the Syrians would rather support Lebanon’s claim as it is their stalking horse to be deployed when it suits their purposes, like right about now when the heat is on over Rafiq Hariri’s murder.
Hezbollah is no Lebanese resistance movement, and Nazrallah is no hero. Anyone who thinks they are is severely delusional.
August 15th, 2006 at 12:33 am
http://globalverm.blogspot.com/
I am always pissed at myself for constantly being surprised by the injustice of Islamic fascist…sometimes I am just too believing…damn it…damn it to hell
The mideast is nothing but a cat and mouse playing hide and seek in a carnival mirror maze. Nothing is as it seems
August 15th, 2006 at 12:56 am
I think I can _almost_ agree with what “Anonymous Leb” Says, I wish he wasn’t anonymous: “Damn it if you don’t want to release him kill him and get it over with. That’ll be 1117 Lebanese dead instead of 1116 …. here a funny thought when Hizballah kidnapped the two soldiers Israel should have responded by immediately killing quntar and the other 4 or five Lebanese prisoners they have. Hezbollah would have been pissed as hell and killed the two soldiers they have. A few casualties form both sides Hizballah would have learned kidnapping will not get them what they want no civilian Israelis killed no civilian Lebanese killed 80 Israeli soldiers lives spared and hizballah learns a lesson.”
Apart for the fact that it didn’t address the main reasons for the war. Hezbollah had to deflect attention from Iran nuclear program and from Russian slide into authocracy before G8. Israel had to try defuse Katjushas (actually, GRADs) before US war on Iran, US would never allow them to protect their own citisens while US is fighting a Muslim country - remember Saddam’s SCADs? They failed as you know.
Other then that an interesting observation - immoral, illegal and absolutely impossible act would however save 1000+ people on both sides at the cost of less then a dozen of mass-murderers.
August 15th, 2006 at 12:58 am
Wow, I left for a day and that’s when the fun started. That’s sad.
Am I the only one who caught the Raccoon having admitted he had a threesome bit? The rest was just “Israel sucks, no, Hizby sucks, no…blah blah blah.”
But threesome, well done, man.
August 15th, 2006 at 1:20 am
OT: Someone wonders where is the police, court etc.. This stuff turns my stomach
http://news.search.yahoo.com/news/search?p=west+bank+stringer&c=news_photos
August 15th, 2006 at 1:34 am
The problem is, people’s regard for their own children should transfer to their enemies’ children.
Nasrallah & Co? Hamas? … have NO regard for either. I have not read this blog for very long, but I believe All The Posters Here Know That. This gives me hope for the future of the ME, and makes SM’s forum so valuable.
Nasrallah would roll unclothed in a Jewish baby’s blood. Like the dog he is. I own a couple of dogs. One of them once crept up on the other’s litter, took one of them up in its teeth and broke its neck. Just because it wanted to and could get away with it before anybody could stop it. People should be better than dogs. From Samir Kuntar twenty years ago, to the “refrigerated dead baby brigade” of today, is this the kind of people anybody wants to represent them?
Arafat’s daughter, handsomely fattened by the corrupt gold of her daddy, now has her toenails painted in the salons of France. Nasrallah sent his son into the vortex; but fat nasty Nasrallah remains - to mock Lebanon as Iran’s dutiful little puppet.
Dance, Nasrallah, dance! Speak, on the Big Television! If only the Pinocchio legend were true about puppets, Nasrallah’s nose would house half the winged kingdom of the Amazon basin. “The Lebanese people have Achieved Victory!”, he says. Ha. The Mullahs of Iran, and the Assads of Syria are feasting on the ruin of Lebanon’s Cedar Revolution like vampires. Yum yum.
Lebanon, do the men of your army have 1/2 the courage of the Israeli army’s women? Will you assist in the fight for your country against its true enemies?
Or will you continue to suck the dirt from Nasrallah’s, Mr. Iran’s, & Assad’s toenails?
The SM might say “Sigh!” No. I have hope. The first thing to acknowledge: the least of your worries is Israel.
August 15th, 2006 at 1:41 am
“Arafat’s daughter, handsomely fattened by the corrupt gold of her daddy, now has her toenails painted in the salons of France. Nasrallah sent his son into the vortex; but fat nasty Nasrallah remains - to mock Lebanon as Iran’s dutiful little puppet.”
*Pissing on Debroah’s face*
August 15th, 2006 at 1:49 am
The biggest Israeli pussy have spoken, bye bye resolution!
“We will continue pursuing [Hezbollah leaders]… and we do not intend to ask anyone’s permission”
Ehud Olmert
August 15th, 2006 at 3:14 am
Oh, my!
“*Pissing on Debroah’s face*”
Now, is this what you call “civilized” behaviour, Mo? Weren’t you upset by the very same behaviour earlier? I would think you would set a better example.
What would your mother say if she heard you talk like that?
August 15th, 2006 at 3:21 am
Faith,
I’m quoting a friend of mine. Don’t worry baby.
August 15th, 2006 at 3:29 am
Bye bye resolution? And of course, that would be Israel’s fault, since
“Rockets hit Lebanon despite cease-fire” is the title of this Yahoo News article here: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060815/ap_on_re_mi_ea/lebanon_israel
Of course, if you read the actual text of the article, you notice this:
“Highlighting the fragility of the peace, Hezbollah guerrillas fired at least 10 Katyusha rockets that landed in southern Lebanon early Tuesday, the Israeli army said, adding that nobody was injured.”
Well, there’s an accurate headline :eyeroll:
But yeah, if the ceasefire is breached, it will be Israel’s fault. Never mind this:
“The army said that none of the rockets, which were fired over a two-hour period, had crossed the border and so it had not responded.”
or this:
“The spokesman said that Israeli soldiers did not return fire.” (from al-Jazeera, of all places http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/28B398D5-2FBC-4C7F-9386-1D0F64FF9C06.htm)
But yeah - if the ceasefire collapses, it will be Israel’s fault. Why? Because they’re Israel, and that’s reason enough.
August 15th, 2006 at 3:37 am
Akiva,
Here is the BBC report.
“Israeli officials told the AFP news agency that in each case soldiers had opened fire “when armed men tried to approach” and had not broken the terms of the UN ceasefire.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4791125.stm
You need to read and tell the whole story.
August 15th, 2006 at 3:43 am
And here is AP reporting
” the Israeli army said, adding that nobody was injured. The army said that none of the rockets, which were fired over a two-hour period, had crossed the border and so it had not responded.”
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/L/LEBANON_ISRAEL?SITE=AKFAI&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&SECTION=HOME
August 15th, 2006 at 3:46 am
CNN
“The rockets landed inside Lebanese territory, and Israeli forces will not respond to their firing, a military spokesman said.”
“Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said Monday that Israel would continue to go after Hezbollah.”
“We will continue to pursue them everywhere and at all times,” he said in a speech to the Knesset. “We have no intention of asking anyone’s permission.”
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/08/14/mideast.main/index.html
August 15th, 2006 at 4:26 am
Mohammed: you obviously didn’t even check the link to the video that I provided. If you had, you would have noticed that the LGF page links to a 60 MINUTES program called “Pallywood” about how palestinians faked several incidents. The camera crews are palestinian, the images are unedited. Is it unreliable? Check it yourself. For the third and last time:
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/?entry=22061&only
But after this I’ll just laugh the next time one of you speaks about Israeli atrocities in the Gaza strip.
August 15th, 2006 at 4:41 am
Stop that, Alex! Don’t interrupt Mohamed. He’s on Jihad.
August 15th, 2006 at 4:45 am
I don’t mean to be a dick, but I am looking forward to the day when Israel/thewest etc… treats their enemies with the same brutality that seems to be the standard in muslim/arab culture. I would pay to see the expression on the 100,000 mohamed’s and tworsets face when people stop playing the game. It may seem clever now to hide among civilians and wage prepetual war, but it will end up destroying you and your communities.
If you (arabs/muslims in general) decide that war with the states is a good idea everyone will know when they have given up by the smell six miles in the air.
August 15th, 2006 at 4:53 am
Someone up there said that trouble started by Twosret, the abuse started by anonon on post # 9 when she jumped off her ass and shouted her craziness, followed by post #10 when Kranky posted his filth.
As we clearly see again on Post # 199 the all ready to start a fight anonon whose husband watching and I’m telling him :lem el hayga beta3tak dih shewya law enta ragel, la2n momken neshtamha bardo mahana bena3raf shatayem zayaha we nebahadalaha bardo.
So quoting CNN, BBC, AP is Jihad a777a Kos omek begad.
mike,
you are a dick don’t worry.
August 15th, 2006 at 4:59 am
alex,
I don’t visit LGF even if they are posting porn. If you have it somewhere else I don’t mind seeing it.
Samasem, Don’t even bother, she is mentally not stable, trolls like her come and leave here often. I only insult those I like.
August 15th, 2006 at 5:04 am
Hello, I am new here and my sister has gotten me hooked reading SMs blog for it’s biting and snarky writing about the ME situation. I am from a country thousands of miles away from this conflict but it has captured my attention nevertheless. There is one thing I noticed about the way Arab posters generally react to the issues. Either Israel is completely and categorically condemned while Arab countries/leaders/policies are defended, or Israel is condemned and the Arab countries are criticized significantly less harshly. I don’t get it.
If Israel is to be condemned, I think the harsher and louder words of condemnation should be for the government of the Arab nations and those who are mandated to protect and serve the people, and to put the welfare of the people as the utmost priority. Let me give you an example. I have many countrymen who were in Lebanon when the war broke out. One thing you have to understand is that my country is 3rd world. We do not have even half the resources that most countries do, but is that an excuse not to evacuate our people and send them home? NO. The government allots a budget to a particular agency that is tasked to look after the welfare of our people abroad. Our embassy in Lebanon has it’s budget, in the process of evacuating our people it was learned that a big chunk of the budget could not be accounted for. The government should be held accountable for these irregularities. Whatever the circmustances, the government should have the will and means necessary to protect the people.
The second problem we encountered was the problem of getting our people away from their employers. There are many reports that the Lebanese employers absolutely refused to let their hired “help” to leave, even amidst the danger, just because they wanted a refund of what they paid the employment agency. I guess for them, hey, “war is no excuse for us not to get our money back.” They also reasoned that Israeli bombardment was limited only to the southern area so there is no problem for them to continue working. Out of desperation to join the evacuation efforts of our embassy, many of my countrywomen jumped out of apartment windows, some suffering injuries, while others unfortunately, died. Again, it is the government’s responsibility to secure our people and bring them home safely. While we are shocked and saddened at the reports of abuse coming out, the focus is not on the abusive employers, but what the government can do for our people. I am not saying we should not seek justice, but it should not be at the expense of delaying evacuation efforts, which should be the most important thing.
If you ask me, the most horrible thing that can happen is for the government to lose sight of what its purpose for being is for. Did the Lebanese government think of the citizens when Hizbullah was allowed to become more powerful through the years? Was Syria? Was Iran? were they thinking of their people? I think not. CONDEMN that, in the strongest possible terms so that the rest of the world can hear you, so the rest of us can even begin to understand you.
Was Israel thinking of its people when they launched missiles at katyushka rockets in Beirut? Yes, and most Israeli people support this. You can agree or disagree but whenever the IDF reacts, it is always for the purpose of protecting the Israeli people. The lives of ones people must come first. DO not ask for the IDF to save you or spare you from missiles, ask that of YOUR government. Ask them why they make decisions without the mandate of the people. Ask them why the lives of the people always come last. WHY??? Why should the pursuit of occupied lands come at the price of civilian lives and destruction? Why should that be compromised? Is that piece of land, once you have it, gonna make everything magically fall into place? Will the Arab nations become instant partners in global stability?
You can criticize Israel but at the end of the day, peace and order, social reforms, employment and livelihood opportunities, and economic stability are dependent on your OWN leaders and your own efforts as a nation. If your leaders are not accountable for anything, I’m afraid progress of any kind will always be a far off dream.
August 15th, 2006 at 5:08 am
mike,
Like which war? the war you couldn’t even defend your country from some katyusha rockets when you have all the most modern equipements in the world? you see without America you are nothing man, America gave you all the knowledge and the technology and you can’t even use it.
Hit and run from the air by airplanes that doesn’t even need a pilot, on the ground you are pussies, don’t worry be the dick you want to be, no shame on that to get out of the closet and proclaim yourself a dick.
The Mossad and IDF can’t even get some savage barbaric Hezbo’s. Man get real mate. A smart army move is to do one operation round them up with the least casualities at both sides and no air bombing. I would have loved to see you get them and get rid of them but you are following the example of USA in Iraq and forgetting that you needed to be prepared better for the terrorists who kicked your ass in 2000 after long years of invading Lebanon.
Your kenessett today grilled the ass of Omert enough.
August 15th, 2006 at 5:25 am
“Someone up there said that trouble started by Twosret, the abuse started by anonon on post # 9 when she jumped off her ass and shouted her craziness, followed by post #10 when Kranky posted his filth.”
BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Oh so typical of fascist islamic trolls! Sarcasm by someone who disagrees with your endless bullshit equals “attack”. Defending against vicious personal attacks by your lot equals ” crazy attack”. Lying, stealing, cheating, mutilation, mass murder and pedophelia by one of your lot equasl 72 recycled virgins. Spoken like a true sociopath.
go on, honey. Think what you want but you and your katyushas still amount to a boil on the ass of humanity. Anyway, don’t you have to go run and hide behind an infant? The ceasefire won’t last, you know .
August 15th, 2006 at 5:39 am
“you see without America you are nothing man,”
Israel is a great country. I am glad the U.S. sends arm’s to Israel instead of “palestine” or “lebanon” (not real countries if you think about it, even though we, you and me buddy, probably send arm’s to both of them). I would rather watch Israeli’s argue about long term peace then watch a horde of muslims (if they had the upper-hand, which they probably never will because they are retarded) debate the merits of raping everyone or just the women while they destroy Israel.
You missed my point. I am not from Israel and I hate you. You all seem to think that beating your chest over attacks on civilians will pay off in the end, it won’t. Eventually the enemy is going to say “fuck it” and hit you back in a bad, bad way.
“Like which war?”
Like every war idiot. (Vietnam and OIF not included, yet:)
August 15th, 2006 at 5:46 am
“Like which war? the war you couldn’t even defend your country from some katyusha rockets when you have all the most modern equipements in the world? you see without America you are nothing man, America gave you all the knowledge and the technology and you can’t even use it.”
Ah! You crack me up!
Outnumbered and out-gunned, Israel kicked your sorry little tails in every single one of its wars with you, you delusional coward. The only reason you didn’t get your ass handed to you THIS time was because Olmert was too much of a pussy to kill all of the babies Hezbollah was trying so desperately to martyr. The world loved Arab babies more than your saviours, the Hezzies, do. Ain’t that a kicker?
I wouldn’t try it again. I’ve never been there, but I hear the Israelis think they’re fighting for survival. Keep it up and they’ll carpet bomb your ass into oblivian.
And don’t be so naive. You know that if you weren’t so united in your genocidal hatred of Jews, you would be engaged in genocidal wars with each other.
Over here, people are starting to understand you Hezzies aren’t as sweet as they thought a week ago. It takes a minute sometimes for Americans to understand that they’re dealing with scum but when they do….well…”Welcome to Iraq and Afghanistan”.
August 15th, 2006 at 9:48 am
203. Binibini
From your post I’d wager you’re from the Philipines or somewhere in the vicinity…
If this is true, I feel for your country(wo)men! My dad was a doctor in northern Saudi Arabia in the mid 80’s, and a couple times he’d had to examine a philipino housemaid, who had been raped by her employer. They had been in a sorry state, so their employers had brought them by the hospital to make sure that they could keep on doing their chores. “Please, don’t report - me not want to lose job!” was pretty much the girls reaction. I can tell you, dad wasn’t in a good mood when he came home from work those days!!!
August 15th, 2006 at 10:07 am
~~~~~~# Twosret Says:
August 14th, 2006 at 12:11 am
Ariya,
Yes Menahem Begin the biggest terrorist does have a site doesn’t he? So why not Kuntar
and they are both .org lol~~~~~~
You think Begin would have smashed a little girl’s head on the rocks?
That’s probably what one gets when being fed too many lies….
Tse.
August 15th, 2006 at 10:59 am
Adam B
Yes I’m from the Philippines. Unfortunately, stories like the one you mentioned are what we hear all the time over here from our countrywomen. It’s rare that any of them talk of employers who were kind, or even decent to them. I don’t want to generalize but that is our reality.
My country is no stranger to the dangers of “Islamic fascism” as well. We have an extremist group called Abu Sayyaf which aims to establish an Iranian-style state in our country. Yes, another group that wants a state within a state. I know too well how civilian people are used as pawns and ultimately suffer the most because of these conflicts. Extremists have no place in the modern and free world.
August 15th, 2006 at 11:20 am
Mohamed,
You posted a report that says that the Israelis killed four guerillas who approached their position and opened fire. I sense skepticism . . .
Yet Hezbollah openly admits that it will continue to attack the Israeli soldiers in Lebanon, despite the cease fire.
Yet Hezbollah has undeniably launched more Katyushas, despite the cease fire.
Yet the Israelis have had the discipline and trustworthiness not to respond to the Katyusha launches since they will not risk killing the ceasefire for impotent posturing from Hezbollah (though God help Lebanon if one of the rockets kills anybody).
So, to review:
Hezbollah has continued attacking. Israel has not responded when not threatened by continued attacks. Therefore, you conclude, it’s probably false when Israelis say they killed Hezbollah fighters who were attacking them. Yeah, that’s logical.
August 15th, 2006 at 11:37 am
“Like which war? the war you couldn’t even defend your country from some katyusha rockets when you have all the most modern equipements in the world? you see without America you are nothing man, America gave you all the knowledge and the technology and you can’t even use it.”
You know what is the biggest problem in the Arab world? Their ability to believe their own propaganda. One of the main reasons Egypt lost so badly in 1967 is because the generals in the field were so afraid to report losses to Nasser that they reported glorious victories instead, and so strategies were planned around nonsensical realities and involved key assets that had already been decimated. And the Egyptian street believed, from what I’ve read, that Egypt was winning the war.
Why do I bring this up now? Because, Mohamed, the quote above is yet another example of this failing.
“you have all the American technology . . “? Use your brain a bit, Mohamed. America has all the American technology and they can’t rout the insurgency in Iraq. You know why? Because technology can’t overcome an inability to pinpoint a fighter in a group of civillians. And, in the end, Israel was less willing to kill Lebanese civillians than Hezbollah was willing to have them die. Be greatful for that - because if that equation ever changes (say if the Hezbollah idiots and their fellow travelers across the Arab world attempt an all out attack on Israel) there won’t be a Lebanon left.
Also, anyone blathering about how “this shows Israel can be destroyed” is - again - either brainless or not bothering to use their brain. Guerilla tactics work only within a complicit population or a brutalized one - a population that will allow the guerillas to fight and disappear, either because they support the guerillas or because they fear them. In other words, these tactics only work - can only work - in Arab territory. Trying them in Israeli territory is suicide, because they can’t blend back in and the population will fight back, rather than be cowed. To wipe Israel off the map will take a conventional army, and we all know what Israel does to those.
Throw in the fact that if by some chance such guerilla tactics do start to work in Israeli territory the equation will have changed, and the conclusion gets even clearer. At that point, Israel will do whatever it needs to to eradicate the threat, including carpet bombing to create a free-fire zone on its northern border, if necessary. Because Israel’s sorrow at being forced to kill Lebanese civillians will never outweigh its need to prevent its own destruction.
Push Israel into a corner, Mohamed, and Israel will push back out. The only result will be the savage beating the countries who idiotically attempt the pushing will take. Oh, and Israel may end up with more land (since that’s what happens every time Arab countries attack it).
August 15th, 2006 at 11:47 am
Oy, Mo, pissing on people’s faces and into various orifices (natural and artificial) online is trademarked by me for about a decade now. Expect a call from my Evil Zionist ™ lawyer!
August 15th, 2006 at 12:17 pm
[...] The Egyptian blogger Sandmonkey raises the issue of Samir Kuntar, the main figure - indeed, the “dean” of Lebanese prisoners - that Hezbollah is so keen to get back. Sandmonkey points out exactly why Kuntar was jailed: In the coastal town of Nahariya, the terrorists shot dead a policeman and forced their way into an apartment building, where they captured Danny Haran and his daughter, Einat, 4. [...]
August 15th, 2006 at 12:20 pm
Racoon
you have the copyright indeed !
August 15th, 2006 at 12:25 pm
Thailand as well. The extremists are executing Buddhist teachers down south, right in front of schoolchildrens, setting off bombs here and there to create chaos. Of all people… defenseless teachers. Cowards.
Oh, don’t forget the extremists in Indonesia. They just love beheading “infidels” for their master.
There are of course kind and loving Muslims around who do not believe in taking the life of others. But I think they themselves fear the extremists and are unable to voice their concerns publicly without risking some form of retribution from the hardliners. For if they don’t share the hardliners’ views, they can easily be “infidel” themselves and be killed in the most cruelest of ways.
How sad it is to be held ransom by your own religion.
August 15th, 2006 at 12:35 pm
Sandmonkey,
Thanks for deleting abusive comments, I really appreciate it.
Twosret
August 15th, 2006 at 1:32 pm
#201 Samasem
“the trouble began … when Kranky posted his filth”…
Uh… pardon me ? I wasn’t the one suggesting an alternative narrative for a child murdering monster. I took someone to task for doing precisely that, someone who should have known better, but chose to believe her bretherens dissimulation rather than objective reality.
Filth? No Samasem. Arabs have been murdering kids in Israel for a LONG time. Specifically targeting them. Getting on busses with then and blowing them up. Picking them off in cars. Shooting pregnant mothers and their children.
Filth? No Samasem. Terminally dishonorable actions on the part of arabs. War crimes, if there was a declared war, and simply crimes otherwise.
Anyone supporting them, dissimulating on their behalf is as bad as they are. And are disgusting to me.
The storm started when it was suggested that the “truth may be in between” narratives. One narrative is known to be correct, the other a whitewashed fabrication.
I understand that there are all sorts of other disgusting narratives running around the arab world. I like the ones which say that Mossad did 9/11 to the US. Or the ones that deny that the arabs or muslims had anything to do with 9/11. Or that muslims don’t kill other muslims. That one is most amusing when you look at Iraq. Lots of narratives.
There is only one objective reality though. In the real universe, 19 arab muslim mass murderers did purposefully board planes, hijack them, and ram them into the buildings. In this same real universe, arab muslims did murder all those kids I pointed to, as well as Tali Hatuel and her babies. In this same real universe, Samir Kuntar happily killed a father in front of a little girl before then killing her in a most brutal manner. Reality is a bitch. It slaps you around hard. You can either accept it, or deny it and go on living in your fantasy universe. Objective reality doesn’t allow a “somewhere in between” interpretation.
In the real universe, many narratives run around the arab and muslem world to try to explain to them that muslims could not possibly be the cause of their own condition. All of these narratives have one thing in common. They deny reality. In that denying of reality arises the real reason for the arab and muslim worlds current state and orientation.
August 15th, 2006 at 1:55 pm
Rickie,
ah yes, to them we are the “infidels.” The rule of law in my country apparently should not apply to them. So there they go beheading any random civilian unlucky enough to cross their paths when the government rejects their demands. Women, children, the elderly, who cares?
But don’t call them terrorists, or extremists, they would rather be known as “freedom fighters.” *snorts*
And I do agree that there are many peace-loving muslims who just want to work and build a life. But the extremists are the ones blowing things up, beheading priests, and kidnapping children so they get front page news. Too bad for the rest of the Muslim population who just want to be left alone. But at some point, you got to reign them in, and god forbid that the infidels try to do that. So, the muslims still have that big responsibility the way I see it.
August 15th, 2006 at 2:41 pm
Twosret,
Sandmonkey did a fine job, glad to see that you are still here and kicking. Ignore my flirting comment, guys are guys and we will never change.
Krank man,
you said “I wasn’t the one suggesting an alternative narrative for a child murdering monster. I took someone to task for doing precisely that, someone who should have known better, but chose to believe her bretherens dissimulation rather than objective reality.”
In the court of law, lawyers cross examine all witnesses. Suggesting an alternative narrative is healthy and debatable, I see big holes in this case just reading few articles, I couldn’t find court records, not sure if Israel provides the world with one. Twosret didn’t post any defense of Mr. Kuntar’s actions, didn’t post that she believed him either. You have to be very careful with loose terms and verbal attacks because you might end up breaking the criminal law in the United States. If you don’t live in the US the international agreements will hold you accountable.
I can count as many as three misdemeanor and maybe one felony in your posts. I’m not trying to scare you, I’m only alerting you that threats even in the cyber world are damaging.
There is nothing wrong on your rant though about hijackers of 9/11 or killings of Israeli children on the hands of arabs. I’m only addressing previous threats and what seems to be a continuation of your slander of Twosret, the deletion of your previous post should make you think a bit.
In good faith and health.
August 15th, 2006 at 3:31 pm
Wow, Lawyerwannabe. You sure like to threaten people on this board.
What’w with the intimidation? If you bring charges, none of them would stand in US court. We don’t have the same libal laws as the UK.
Maybe you want to dial it back a bit? There’s enough tension on the board, I notice.
August 15th, 2006 at 3:49 pm
Faith,
Find a good lawyer and print my opinion to him and chat about it. Re-read my post and focus on the context in which it was written. My post is lawful and contains no intimidation or threats. Don’t use loose terms that you don’t understand.
I didn’t solicit any information that is not within the frame of law. I don’t intend to increase any tension, I’m only alerting Kranky. The end of my statement was in good faith and health and it remains so.
Thank you for your reply.
August 15th, 2006 at 4:57 pm
Speaking of ruthless child killers, everyone should read Esquire’s story on the Beslan school attack:
http://www.esquire.com/cgi-bin/printtool/print.cgi?pages=7&filename=%2Ffeatures%2Farticles%2F2006%2F060610_mfe_June_06_School.html&x=37&y=13
Surely we can all condemn that one without hesitation.
August 15th, 2006 at 6:27 pm
lawyerwannabe, from an actual lawyer, what the heck are you talking about? Kranky made no threats, and nothing he wrote was libelous since it was clearly not written with actual malice and twosret probably counts as a public figure on this blog (particularly since “twosret” is a pseudonym and therefore she can suffer no reputational damage in the world outside this blog). Times v. Sullivan ring a bell?
August 15th, 2006 at 6:58 pm
Lawyer, your thinly veiled threats of suit of law are getting old.*And* they don’t get you much respect, at least not from me.You want to argue, argue to the point please- otherwise don’t.
Is your point is that some things said are actionable in US court?If so what’s new?I sometimes think sneezing on someone is actionable in the US.I saw much worse on internet flamewars, and I’m sure twosret did, too.
August 15th, 2006 at 8:39 pm
Please visit my blog for articles on situation post-bellum.
http://egyptianobserver.blogspot.com
August 15th, 2006 at 8:54 pm
Ye gods!
I come back 24 hours later and this barney is still going on?.
Blimey!.
August 15th, 2006 at 9:21 pm
test
August 15th, 2006 at 9:22 pm
I think Lawyerwannabe might actually be twosret.
in the Christian blogger section, she posted something as Lawyerwannabe but it was from her. In the next post, she acknowledged that she wrote the post but said she didn’t know how it got posted under Lawyerwannabe.. But you have to give your name in the “name” box - she may have just forgotten to change her name back when she was switching between the two. I notice my name stayed in the box even after my “test” comment was posted.
August 15th, 2006 at 9:25 pm
I tried a followup to the wannabe, but it was moderated? Go figure.
Doesn’t matter. Dispensing legal advice in the US without the appropriate license to do so is in fact a felony. I am not a lawyer. I don’t give legal advice. I am not a brain surgeon. You don’t want me poking about in your brain. Wannabe likely is not a lawyer. Taking legal advice from such a person is, well, not advisable.
I have a good group of lawyers working with me, and yeah, I pay them lots of money. Not far too much, but it is probably more per year than a reasonable fraction of people reading this make per year.
I would suggest wannabe curtail its freebie advice, and make sure it discloses whether or not it is an officer of the court. If not, well, …
I would also suggest that the relevant people who made threats (#18) look up the legal definitions of slander, of implicit threat. Consult a real lawyer if you like, your answer is much more likely to be correct than if you look it up yourself. The way it was explained to me when I asked was that slander is a defamation, a purposeful and premeditated communication intentionally designed to cause injury. Of course, I am not a lawyer. I just pay them. One interesting aspect of this is that if you j’accuse someone of slander, you had better have really good evidence. Because you open the possibility of a counter suit once you file, and if your evidence is weak, well …
You get the idea.
Wannabe, think about the hot water you might be getting yourself into by offering legal advice without the standard disclaimer. You might want to consult a real lawyer before you post again.
August 15th, 2006 at 9:28 pm
#229
Ouch. Wouldn’t surprise me. Gonna give wannabe the benefit of the doubt. If it is twos, well
c’est la vie
August 15th, 2006 at 9:36 pm
#225 Akiva
Heh… that may be lost on wannabe.
Nothing here is actionable. If anyone had frished that would be different
.
The issue I see as problematic is a wannabe appearing to be dispensing legal advice, and wannabe is not likely legit as a lawyer. I could be wrong. Wannabe, want to tell us if you are or are not a lawyer and legally licensed to render legal advice? Which firm are you with? Where did you pass the bar? What states/courts are you accredited with?
I am simply ignoring the implied theat in #18. That is at the borders, but I wouldn’t push it. Now what Mo did to Karen, well, thats a bit over the line in my book (but I am not a lawyer and am not rendering legal opinions).
August 15th, 2006 at 10:00 pm
As far as I’m aware saying things like “that’s actionable!” and “you could be sued for that!” don’t qualify as practicing law without a license.
BTW, slander does not need to be intentional or intended to cause injury. If I honestly but incorrectly believe that my next door neighbor is a child molester, and proceed to spread the word to the rest of my building, that’s slander. Truth is a defense; the person claiming slander doesn’t need to prove falsity. It also doesn’t matter whether I intended to harm him or not - the only relevant question is whether he was in fact harmed.
For public figures the standard is different - actual malice. But while “malice” sounds like “intent to harm” that’s not what it means in this context. In the context of defamation, “actual malice” refers to publication (i.e. spreading the word) with either knowledge of its falsity or reckless disregard for the truth. That is, even if the information is false, if I didn’t know it was false, or if I took standard precautions, I can spread it around without liability. That’s because of the fear that speech on important issues would be chilled if, say, the newspaper got sued for slander every time it reported something untrue about a politician because its sources were wrong, or because it published an ad making false claims.
/legal discussion (i hope)
August 15th, 2006 at 10:04 pm
Wishbone,
Tell me about it!
Keep going people sorry for interrupting
August 15th, 2006 at 10:07 pm
Akiva,
I’m not voting you for president
August 15th, 2006 at 10:23 pm
As I noted Akiva, I am not a lawyer. I just pays thems money…
August 15th, 2006 at 10:29 pm
This legal battle would be funny if it weren’t so patently ridiculous. I really doubt there are any deep-pocket plaintiffs here that are ready to throw twenty grand away just to get a pre-trial dismissal on the merits. Lawyerwannabe is obviously a boob with a wikipedia law degree and lack of any common sense.
August 15th, 2006 at 10:30 pm
Jonru
don’t underestimate mom’s 
August 15th, 2006 at 10:43 pm
Twosret,
Not sure what you mean by that response but mom or seasoned trial lawyer; Judges tend show the same level of disdain for vexatious and clueless litigants regardless of their maternal instincts or lack thereof.
August 15th, 2006 at 10:52 pm
“Not sure what you mean by that response”
yes you don’t know what I mean but it is okay, I’m not interested in legal discussions online, as for the deep-pocket comment I agree you don’t throw 20 grand if you have a million, but if you have millions 20 grand is nothing.
Most of the legal solicitation above is based on defamation of character, when in reality it is not about that at all. How can you defame Twosret? in her after life?
August 15th, 2006 at 11:35 pm
Twosret-
“How can you defame Twosret? in her after life? ”
You badmouth her molokhia in this life?
*ducks*
August 15th, 2006 at 11:38 pm
Twos,
hey, gimme a few years. As soon as I get through a trial that looks like it’s scheduled for february, I’m opening that blog for real. Figure a ten year run-up is about the time it’ll take for an independent to have any shot (not that I think I’ll have one, but still, it’ll be fun
)
And Kranky, if you ever fell like paying another lawyer, e-mail me
(hey, this may be the only way I ever bring in clients to the firm, what with my lack of connections)
August 16th, 2006 at 1:23 am
Avika,
Hey I’m all for women for president, post your agenda and I will keep give you a shot, I’m sure in the begining of your career it might be hard to find clients but they will come eventually. Two things I don’t mess with my doctors and my lawyers, I always pick the best of the best even if I’m just doing a will or estate planning.
What is your speciality if you don’t mind me asking?
August 16th, 2006 at 1:29 am
Twosret: I look it up because I want to learn all sides of the story and what happened in an attempt to use my mind unlike you, jump on the internet and shout at people who might differ or try to look up other sources. So reading about Hitler is a crime these days? checking out the history of the holocaust is a crime?
BS BS BS .. I bet you pounced back on here in a heartbeat as soon as you found that link. If for no other reason than to wave it in all the zionists faces (and SMs too methinks). If you had continued to keep searching you would have given up on the “oh wikipedia is user-editable so completely useless” arguement. There would have been a thousand other hits, not Israeli nor user-editable, detailing the man’s notority.
I also wonder if you would even bother googling this if it were a Jewish man in an Arab jail…
August 16th, 2006 at 1:33 am
Litigation. Odd that you mention estate planning, since the trial coming up is a probate trial (which is weird enough for me since it wasn’t was I was expecting when I signed on at a large NY firm - but it’s an interesting case that I’m getting a lot of responsibility on, so no complaints).
FYI - and here I am costing myself votes
- Akiva is actually a male name (famous rabbi, and a derivation of yakov [hebrew for jacob])
BTW, as a relative newbie here, I have to ask - is it always like this when SM takes a hiatus?
August 16th, 2006 at 1:40 am
here a funny thought when Hizballah kidnapped the two soldiers Israel should have responded by immediately killing quntar and the other 4 or five Lebanese prisoners they have.
Hezbollah would have been pissed as hell and killed the two soldiers they have.
AnonLeb I just may have to agree with you
August 16th, 2006 at 1:40 am
Scouser,
“You badmouth her molokhia in this life?”
My Molokhia oh no!, I would highly recommend you don’t mess with the curse of the Pharaoh’s
August 16th, 2006 at 1:47 am
#242 Akiva
Gonna have to invent a new name for this… blog chasing
?
I’ll look you up one day and say hi via email.
August 16th, 2006 at 1:51 am
Akiva,
oops! sorry
SM blogs more than anyone else I know and he posts tons of posts on daily basis, I’m surprised he is taking time off. He stopped working and enjoying his life inbetween jobs I guess.
Jason,
You told me before not to take you seriously, you are such a bully :)and trying to pull my leg I kNOW IT! tomorrow I will hold a sign at st.clair with your name and phone number on it
August 16th, 2006 at 1:57 am
*I will hold a sign at St.Clair&yonge*
August 16th, 2006 at 2:18 am
That didn’t take long …
In my spam filter:
“GREETINGS FROM ME.
I AM FATIMA SROUR. I AM 54YEARS OLD WOMAN, THE WIFE OF LATE MR. MAHMOUD SROUR, A CITIZEN OF LEBANON AND HOSPITALIZED IN NAJEM HOSPITAL IN TYRE,
…
WHEN MY LATE HUSBAND WAS ALIVE HE DEPOSITED THE SUM OF US$10.5 MILLION” …
August 16th, 2006 at 2:32 am
Many arguements presented by Twosret is valid and true, the KKK link you refer to was posted on an article that refers to no hate, an article that anyone who wouldn’t know who the author is other than a PHD holder and a Lousiana representative of the Gov. in the United States of America as an analysis to some control of Jews to the media.
Ummm so defending Twosret here for “researching” one dude, you don’t see her lack of researching another dude? Hmmm?
“Call the electrician, some wires seem to have burned”
August 16th, 2006 at 2:39 am
yup your wires are crossed and burnt for sure Jason. What was that number you posted again? I have to report you to 1-800-bully
August 16th, 2006 at 2:39 am
St Clair & Yonge? What a poor publicity corner!!! I DEMAND Bloor & Yonge!!! or maybe High Park .. yeah High Park.. feed the ducks ..
God too many posts in here to read all at once lol…
You know I like to “pick on” ya
But seriously, If Lebanon likes child killers, can we send them Karla Homolka and Paul Bernardo? He, alone, costs a couple hundred thousand a year.
August 16th, 2006 at 2:40 am
Hey I picked on someone else (forget who) there with the wires… and who said I shipped with any
August 16th, 2006 at 2:40 am
Twos,
did anyone ever tell you that smiley faces are not punctuation marks?
You don’t need them after ever sentence. A little is okay but….
August 16th, 2006 at 2:45 am
Hey Skeptic!!! LEAVE THE SMILEYS ALONE!!! What did they ever do to you? Hmmm? LOL
August 16th, 2006 at 3:00 am
Islam has no concept of the state . Consequently there is not a clear difference between a war and a raid upon infidels undertaken by individuals . Rules of war and the concept of civilians are western christian concepts. Such concepts cannot be expected from a culture which expects to ransom, enslave or kill all members of infidel tribes as a religious obligation . The facts of what Kuntar did is are not in dispute. The interpretation is . Kuntar is a great Islamic warrior but a judeo-christian child murderer.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:09 am
Thanks for the long winded explanation of libel vs. slander Kavima; i’m sure everyone is impressed with your understanding of the concept. Simply put, an insulting statement that does not harm ones reputation (be they print or verbal) is prima facie non-libelous/slanderous and has no standing under the color of law.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:11 am
skippy,
It is for those who have sense of humor not you. If you don’t like them you do have an option to scroll down.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:27 am
Jonru,
Enta bany adam Khara awy (let your friends translate this to you).
August 16th, 2006 at 3:28 am
Jason,
Hey! Were YOU ever asaulted by a gang of wild roaming smiley faces? HUH? You have NO idea!
LOL!
No, they’re just a little hard on tired eyes when there are too many of them in one post is all.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:28 am
OOOOHHH! the equivelant of “nya nya nya nya nya” from two. Who would have ever expected that!?
Jeez
August 16th, 2006 at 3:42 am
Lighten up skippy, life is not that bad after all, look at you, you have a computer and you can type. What else can you ask for?
August 16th, 2006 at 3:42 am
Mike Alpha,
eh…in the strictest and most medieval interpretation of Islam, some of what you say is sort of true. However, in the strictest most medieval interpretation of Catholic doctrine, this would also be true. Moreover, rules of raiding are also covered in Islam and prohibit taking things like cookery equipment, and killing or hurting the likes of women, children and the aged. The Kuntar issue is interpretated the same way by both Islam and modern Christianity.
However, rules are rules and people are people. Who says that that which is a religious or cultural concept is always followed by individuals?
For instance, there was radical crazy Christian by the name of Rudolph who blew up family clinics here in the US, killing the people inside those clinics. Seems he was against abortion cuz he was all “pro-life” and stuff. I guess the irony was lost on him. Anyway, the guy was a complete terrorist and evaded capture for years but he was a big hero to a certain arm of the extreme religious right in the US. Doesn’t mean the wider culture accepts him as a hero …and it doesn’t mean most Muslims think Kuntar is a hero.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:46 am
Silence skippy!!!!!!mike the alpha and omega Jihadi Rabbi has spoken. Listen carefully, he doesn’t like kids noises around him when he preach.
August 16th, 2006 at 3:56 am
Jason don’t want to be visible in Forest Hill area? comm’on who would in his sane mind turn down an offer like mine. Look up Forest Hill, you can’t beat that with the commerical Bloor&Yonge.
I’m talking big fat Rich Fatima’s that will feed you the fancy Kosher meals for the rest of your life.
No smileys so skippy won’t flip
August 16th, 2006 at 4:04 am
Ok kiddo’s better hit the sack, gonna have to start early tomorrow.
Skippy, Brush your teeth and tongue before you go to bed.
August 16th, 2006 at 4:06 am
“he doesn’t like kids noises around him when he preach.”
Oh yeah? then why you flappin’ yer trapp still?
Whatever, Jahilah.
It’s late. The employed have to sleep.
G’night.
August 16th, 2006 at 4:32 pm
Blog-chasing. I like that
August 16th, 2006 at 5:20 pm
Off topic but on a related note:
Today, the first of three british soldiers is to be released from jail in Cyprus after serving less than 12 years of an original 24 year sentence for abducting, gang-raping and finally beating a danish tour-guide to death with a shovel, and finally burying her in a shallow grave next to the road.
One wonders why England would even want to see these animals back in their country, or why anyone would dream of releasing them after less than half their sentence has been served…!?
If I was the father of that girl, I think I’d buy a one-way ticket to England, get myself a gun and shoot their brains out.
August 16th, 2006 at 7:24 pm
Gross! I I were a mother in England, I wouldn’t want those monsters anywhere near my kids. How did they only get 24 years in the first place? Never mind the reduction in their sentence.
August 16th, 2006 at 10:04 pm
I remember that…..Little shits should have been hanged.
August 17th, 2006 at 12:29 am
“I’m talking big fat Rich Fatima’s that will feed you the fancy Kosher meals for the rest of your life.”
And this interests me how? Already told ya, I’m not kosher on kosher
August 17th, 2006 at 12:56 am
Oh Jason you are an infidel indeed!
August 17th, 2006 at 1:46 am
I am my own man. Get it? Got it? Good!
August 17th, 2006 at 2:13 am
cute
August 17th, 2006 at 2:39 am
Sceptic,
I am aware of the various “rules of war” . To an unsympathic eye , such as mine, these rules prevent the destruction of what may become valuable loot, date grovs, future slaves and ransomees (of which the prophet recieved 1/5). The rules are matters of tacticals or economics not morality.
Consequently I dont admit equivalence of christian behavior before the peace of Westphalia and Islamic behavior. I do admit that christian behavior was much “worse” before that peace than it became afterwards . But western countries (in which I include Israel) are post-Westphalian while Al-queda, Hezb’allah and other fundamntalist Islamic groups adhere quite closly to original Islamic teachings.
My point is that it’s not the facts of Kuntars’ actions that are in question. It is the moral judgement one passes upon those actions.
By fundamentalist Islamic teachings nothing Kuntar did is particularly reprehensible, he is instead praiseworthy.
August 17th, 2006 at 1:26 pm
Mike,
An unsympathetic eye should still not over-look the truth. The truth is that rules of raiding also prevent the destruction of non-combatants. Kuntar violated that rule.
People in the West (which is where I am) have a difficult time understanding that “fundamentalist Islam” is a bit of a misnomer. Which fundamentals? On which Haddiths do these fundamentals rely? There are haddiths in Islam which are so brutal as to make your blood run cold reading them. There are others which are completely the opposte.
Al Qaeda and other terror groups pick through Islamic doctrine to find the versus and haddiths that justify their behaviour instead of taking the doctrine as a whole. Other parts of the doctrine restrain such bloody-minded behaviour quite severely. Extremist groups completely ignor that part of Islam. So, what you describe as “fundamental Islam” is, in fact, more like “fractional Islam”. We have that problem in Christianity as well - although, the outcome is far less bloody.
“By fundamentalist Islamic teachings nothing Kuntar did is particularly reprehensible, he is instead praiseworthy.”
This is indeed true. It is mindboggling how ANYONE can see his actions as acceptable but there is a portion of the population that does. However, most Muslims do not practice this Islam. There are those that do and because of their actions and because the beat the Jihad war drums, dominate the spotlight. You never get to hear the moderate voice which rejects this barbaric behaviour because it is calm and cannot be heard above the war cries of the extremists.
I don’t disagree that Kuntar is seen as a hero by certain factions of Islam. I don’t disagree that we in the West get the impression every Muslim sees his actions as acceptable. I’m just saying that this is not an accurate assessment of the wider Muslim view on Kuntars actions.
I think the bigger problem with regard to Kuntar is not that most Muslim don’t think the acts he committed were barbaric but the denial that he committed those acts in the first place. That’s a substantial problem in the Arab world in general. Denial and conspiracy theories.
August 17th, 2006 at 3:31 pm
Same logic applied above goes to the Israeli Jihadi Rabbi club, what is even more scarey is that those people are Gov. officials, they don’t sound any different than A.J. or Hitler himself, oh I forgot he is the one who taught them the lesson and now they apply it on Palestinians. Those quotes are random from the 30’s to the 80’s and to the best of my knowledge the ideolgy didn’t change much did it?
“We must expel Arabs and take their places.”
David Ben Gurion, future Prime Minister of Israel, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.
“Spirit the penniless population across the frontier by denying it employment… Both the process of expropriation and the removal of the poor must be carried out discreetly and circumspectly.”
Theodore Herzl, founder of the World Zionist Organization, speaking of the Arabs of Palestine,Complete Diaries, June 12, 1895 entry.
“We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves.”
Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.
“We walked outside, Ben-Gurion accompanying us. Allon repeated his question, What is to be done with the Palestinian population?’ Ben-Gurion waved his hand in a gesture which said ‘Drive them out’”
Yitzhak Rabin, leaked censored version of Rabin memoirs, published in the New York Times, 23 October 1979.
“We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab population.”
Israel Koenig, “The Koenig Memorandum”
August 17th, 2006 at 4:31 pm
Twosret, as I remarked once before I find it telling that you bring no comment from the last years.Should I bring up comments by Arab and Iranian Leaders from, let’s say, the last 5 years?Preferably with bias toward 2003 and on?
In addition, according to this letter, written by Ami Iserof two of your current quotes(and at least one you used previously) are false and were never actually said/written.
August 17th, 2006 at 4:51 pm
Anton,
You are welcome to quote any arab leader, I never opposed that, I myself if you read my introduction to the Quotes said I can equate the following to A.J. (Iran president if you don’t know who I’m talking about)
I can write a letter myself to anyone claiming that this never happened. How many incidents including the recent Qana in Lebanon that Israel claimed it never happened?
Yeah the Pyramids were built by Japanese and the great wall of china was built by Pharaohs.
I stand by every quote above as correct and reliable source. If you don’t think so then that is your opinion you are welcome to say so.
August 17th, 2006 at 5:42 pm
Twosret,
No, you don’t stand behind your sources as correct or reliable. You have no way of verifying them. None at all. All you can do is say “someone said that someone said that someone said… but with zero evidence I believe completely. This is not standing behind, this is faith.
Another website denounces all your quotes as fake:
http://www.ngo-monitor.org/archives/news/122304-1.htm
They present some evidence of the quotes being fake- but without accurate copies of the original documents, who can be sure?. You have no evidence they are real. None. Just words. And they are not your words. Nor did you experience them directly. All you have is what others told you. So, there is nothing, absolutely nothing, for you to stand behind.
When someone calls your own words into question, then is the time to stand behind them.
Just remember, when someone tells you “there are no American tanks in Bagdad”, try changing the TV to other channels before agreeing.
Ben
August 17th, 2006 at 7:40 pm
Ben,
That is what you do best DENIAL.
August 17th, 2006 at 9:12 pm
I’d like to see the source of those quotes as well. I find them deplorable and would like to know for a fact that they’re not the concoction of another Comical-Ali…
August 17th, 2006 at 9:17 pm
Is sameer al-qintar worse than SOME israeli soldiers ?? I dont think so. That soldier who shot a Gazan girl with his M16 , more than 30 shots, for self defense is NOT as pure as Sameer. Sameer is now in prison, but that soldier is now in some restaurant or in some other country : let free by his govt.
Shameful.
August 17th, 2006 at 9:24 pm
Hmmm…..
and the Nazis trained Mufti Husseini who regularly urged them to “kill more Jews”. Then he came back to the ME and urged the Arabs to….well, you know.
I bet next we’ll be quoting popes from the 10th century to “prove” modern day conspiracies theories.
Stay tuned…….
Anyway, I think the Israelis really suck at this whole genocide thing! I mean, Hitler managed to exterminate 6 million Jews and an almost equal number of gypsies and slavs in less than a decade and here Israel has been slogging away at its Palestinian genocide for nearly 60 years and the number of Palestinians just keeps GROWING at aln alarming rate! WTF? I thought Jews had the reputation of being successful! Fire those Jews and bring someone who can actually do the job!!!!!!!
August 17th, 2006 at 9:50 pm
Osaid,
Yep. And Sharon (the Butcher of Beirut) should have been charged with War Crimes for Sabra and Shatila. I don’t even know how that was avoided, to be honest.
However, you are way off base when you use that as an arguement an for why Kuntar should be released. For that logic to work we must assume that if one guilty man goes free, ALL guilty men should not be incarcerated. This is not logical.
I have no idea what soldier you’re talking about and know nothing about the case. But for the sake of argument, let’s say that he shot that little girl at close range, with no provocation (she didn’t have, say, an AK-47 trained on him at the time), etc. etc., then you should be seeking to LOCK HIS ASS UP and let him rot in prison right beside Kuntar. that mo-fo is a danger to society. You shouldn’t be seeking the release of Kuntar. You should be seeking the incarceration of private mo-fo. No?
August 17th, 2006 at 10:08 pm
286. osaid:
Like anonon said, the question isn’t whether Kuntar is the biggest monster alive - he probably isn’t. Unfortunately, there are probably others just like him out there.
The question is why arabs/muslims wants him released. If a soldier from the western world did somehing similar, we’d have his ass in prison for as long as we could (and feel seriously offended if he was released early - http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/4792915.stm )
August 17th, 2006 at 10:35 pm
to my dearest friend twosret,
I am in a posting frenzy at the moment as I will be away for the rest of the everning
but I will leave you with this…
You seem to be on a jihad to prove that all Israelis are dogs because you somehow feel that others don’t think Arabs are worth much. You make inane references to the “Rabbi Jihadi Club”. I know it’s a joke but all jokes (especially those repeated ad infinitum) have a grain of truth. As far as I can tell nobody here feels that way.
No sane person believes that Arabs are unworthy animals. Nobody says that their lives are worth less than the lives of Jews (and other assorted folk).
The Israelis are not as pure as the driven snow. Nobody says they are. Nobody but nobody in their right minds. There are many many many many legitimate complaints about Israel for Israelis to fix. If it will make you feel better, I can make a list for you sometime so that I may have the honour of making your day.
We all know we can find a vast array of bloody-minded, murderous rhetoric and inane rants by more than one vicious Israeli and/or Jew. Not to mention the Jewish versions of Hamas and Hezbollah - Kach and the “illustrious” Kahane Hai come to mind. The biggest difference between the Muslim and the Jewish version is that Kach and Kahane Hai have been outlawed, defanged, declawed and forced into submission where they continue their inane racist rants on the oustskirts of society’s lunatic fringe but are not able to take action or rally support.
You continue to post countless quotes from long ago. I get the impression that you find those quotes completely unforgivable - no matter how old they are. If that is the case then there is a problem. In fact, this is a general problem with the Middle East - there are NO expiration dates on anything. Muftis in Egypt give 1,300 year old accounts of wrongs committed against Muslims by mangy Jews (one account had a jew pulling the veil off a woman) as reasons for why we cannot, today or ever, trust the Jews. How are we to move on, to live together in this world if we can never forgive anyone for anything? How can we ask the Jewish state to forgive the past words and actions of Hamas and Hezbollah and assorted zealots, to move forward to a peaceful and (hopefully) prosperous cohabitation if Arabs cannot forgive the past words of Israeli terrorists (the Kahane Hais and Kaches) and assorted zealots?
The Arabs are not demons
but neither are the Israelis
In my opinion, it would make for a much much better discussion if we stopped defending issues based on which clan we belong to rather than the individual facts of individual cases. Don’t you think?
August 17th, 2006 at 11:26 pm
#290 anonon
For the most part I agree, putting aside some of my misgivings at your descriptions.
Here is what it all boils down to. [Crazy and jew hating people should stop reading at this point, because their heads may spontaneously combust]
Israel wants peace. Internally. Externally.
I believe and I hope, that some sizable fraction of the arabs, not the leaders and hate mongers, also want peace. These people want peace internally and externally.
The people on both “sides” who want peace, tend to deplore murder, destruction, and death. They want to live their lives, love their families, experience the world around them.
The discourse between bloggers at the early stages of this conflict give me hope that “normal” people get it.
The sense I get is that when people can control the media, and control their governments, and any entities in their land, that things may become saner. As you noted, when you defang a Kahane and other bigots, relegate them to the fringes of society, which may be too close still to society, they cannot influence society, and drag it into unwise situations.
I wonder if we have learned from WWII. Prior to WWII we collectively allowed fascist loudmouths who should have been marginalized and defanged, to gain power and war materiel. What happened next is best described as a gruesome domino effect, one that eventual claimed something like 20M lives.
Here we stand again now, on the brink of abyss with fascist loudmouths who should be marginalized and defanged, but have instead gained power and nuclear war materiel. Any guesses as to what happens next? The little hezb adventurism has turned out to be the opening volley of this event. Any guess on how many lives this one will claim?
If we are collectively dumb enough to let this evolve as we have in the past, I suspect that at least an order of magnitude more people will meet their maker than in WWII.
The only way to stop it is, IMO, to get people talking to people. Enough people talk, and we will see that lots of them are on the same “side” with common enemies of the loudmouth fascists.
Israel haters will never be pacified, we simply need to give them time to fall out of the picture. We need to stop incitedment and dehumanization in the arab media that places like MEMRI document so well.
Until that is done, the fascist loudmouths that opened up the volley will have a steady stream of new recruits, and defanging them will be impossible. As could be seen from the de-nazification programs after WWII, defanging is hard work and takes time. Relegation to fringes can only occur when enough of the population agree that this is the right thing to do, and then do it. Political change comes as a result of this too.
August 17th, 2006 at 11:28 pm
The person above me thinks that I will ever engage with her in any conversation or discussion after she verbally raped my children, my family and myself. She actually have the audcity to address me. Shame!!!
August 17th, 2006 at 11:53 pm
Twosret, I love your blog especially the last two entries.
anonon, Never once has TWosret advocated that ALL Israelis are dogs, she never promoted revenge against Israelis, I have always admired her one state solution or two state solution based on justice and peace, she is always against the politicians and always a sympathizer for the people of Israel, she promoted million times her hope for peace and co-existance. You don’t know Twosret because you are new here and I don’t blame you. She is against war and aggression period!, I’m very disappointed to see that you chose a reasonable discussion with her after the wave of very hurtful attacks on her.
Kinky aka Kranky,What did I do to Karen?, you are lucky I’m busy these days and not kicking your ass on hourly basis.
Karen aka KiKi, Miss you baby didn’t mean to bother you, come back honey cake to daddy
Osaid, keep posting man don’t give up.
Nomad and The Raccoon, let us do Amesterdam guys, legal sex, legal weed, legal FUN.
August 17th, 2006 at 11:55 pm
The Raccoon, Your Jewish lawyer called me and said I can piss on Adam only, not one else and for that;
*Takes out his d*ck and pisses in Adam mouth as he speaks*
August 18th, 2006 at 3:29 am
Whining and sniveling and peeing on people and somebody did this and that to somebody 1300 years ago and 1300 years ago my people were real big wigs and therefore Bow Down Now Infidels and we want Mr. Big Manly Baby Killer back so as to make him into a Big Manly Poster Boy for…
What, exactly.
What kind of people does the ME want to lead it? We should have so much else to offer. So what is it?
P.S. That whole peeing in people’s face thing, Mohamed, is Such A Smooth Move.
August 18th, 2006 at 3:29 am
Mohamed,
Please don’t follow Racoony’s foot steps. I have no clue who Adam is and why on another topic he decided to attack me, I don’t know if I ever replied to his posts, the name doesn’t ring a bell at all.
Please don’t start a fight with anyone because of me, I’m capable to reply to anything that is worth replying to.
My position never changed on the co-existance with Israelis, peace based on justice.
What have you been up to lately?
August 18th, 2006 at 3:42 am
Deborah,
1979 and 1983 quotes are not that too long ago is it? never mind the quotes, the aggression that is taking place everyday on the hands of Israeli adminstration speaks louder than words.
Mohamed and The Raccoon joke around like guys do. The Raccoon is an Israeli and Mohamed (I’m assuming) Egyptian.
Lighten up Deborah, Mohamed is messing with the Raccoon (My fav. Jew of all times). Where does that take Egypt and Israel? don’t know really maybe fun on the account of Adam.
August 18th, 2006 at 4:50 am
294. Mohamed:
????
I guess it’s meant as a joke, but it’s not really funny…
August 18th, 2006 at 4:51 am
heh heh … poor Mo. If you want a tuchas to kick, look in the mirror.
August 18th, 2006 at 12:53 pm
anonon :
Absolutely right. I agree with you
My point was : israel is dealing with the palestinians in double standards. This surely striked its ‘democratic’ structure.
August 18th, 2006 at 12:54 pm
Momo, Amsterdam, no way, (too cold) !
and I am a pro Bacchus religion , I is more fun and less crazyness !
August 18th, 2006 at 1:16 pm
Regarding the quotes above ..
Why going back into history, let us look at what OLMERT said when an Israeli soldier was kidnapped in Gaza 2 months ago..
GAZA (Reuters) - Israel warned the governing Palestinian faction Hamas that the “sky will fall on them” if they harm a captured soldier after a deadline passed on Tuesday for the Jewish state to accept a prisoner exchange.
While Israeli tanks and infantry massed along the Gaza Strip’s northern border for a threatened ground incursion, Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said the campaign to free Corporal Gilad Shalit could turn into “a long war.”
Three Palestinian factions, among them the Hamas armed wing, pulled out of negotiations with Egyptian mediators trying to end the standoff over Shalit, a Hamas political leader said.
Mr. Olmert will MAKE THE SKY FALL ON GAZA if they hurt the Israeli soldier.
Olmert’s mentality should bring him side by side near Sameer Qintar..
or what ??
August 18th, 2006 at 1:26 pm
Osaid,
“My point was : israel is dealing with the palestinians in double standards. This surely striked its ‘democratic’ structure.”
Yes. Absolutely that happens. Unfortunately, when Israel is forced to fight groups whose sole stated purpose is to annihilate the country it distracts attention from these and many other important issues. When Israel’s security is threatened, it tightens the noose. That, in turn, makes life for the Palestinians even more unbearable. That’s why I can’t stand it when the likes of HA and Iran co-opt the Palestinian “cause” so they can twirl in the spotlitght at the center of the world’s political stage while the Palestinians are left twisting in the wind as a result.
Am I too naive when I look at Jordan and Egypt and wonder why we can’t achieve the same with other countries and move on to working on a viable Palestinian state? I think I may be.
August 18th, 2006 at 1:38 pm
Aaahhh, twosrest! You really don’t pick up on subtle sarcasm do you? And you honestly think my post was actually written for your benefit. Sad.
Honey, I got your number when you called me a “Russian Jew Convert” and then led a vicious and unprovoked attack on my intelligence, my family, and mocked mine and my family’s escape from the World Trade Center on September 11th. I guess, like HA, you don’t expect anyone to fire back at you and when they do you claim there’s a ‘”jihad” against you. You are a Joke.
Mo, you can think what you want about my vicious attacks on her. They were no more vicious than her attacks on me and her attack was unprovoked. If you don’t think I have the right to retaliate, you have the right to that opinion. Incidentally, you don’t know me either - as you said, I’m new.
In any case, this is a boring discussion and clogs the board with unnecessary drival so this is my last post on the topic.
August 18th, 2006 at 1:58 pm
Kranky,
I’m sorry you had misgivings about some of the things I said. What I mean is that like all countries, Israel has had its share of zealots. Sometimes, though, Israel has not been as good at controlling or punishing them. I don’t understand why Sharon wasn’t court marshalled in Israel for Sabra and Shatila. I really don’t. Maybe you can explain it to me but right now I don’t get it.
“Israel wants peace. Internally. Externally.”
I know that. And it’s in the interest of that peace that it has defanged and declawed its Zealots and terrorists - individual incidents aside. Israel understands that which the wider Muslim world doesn’t yet: these terror groups rot its society from within. They devour the soul and the hope of the very people they claim to fight for. It also destabilizes the government - wasn’t Ytizak Rabin murdered by a student who bought into Kahane Hai’s “drive the Arabs from the land. No peace with the Arabs.” war cry? I hope that one day the wider Muslim world realizes that HA and Hamas are rotting its society more than they can ever hurt the Israelis. Until then….
August 18th, 2006 at 2:50 pm
anonon,
Go and learn some Karate to let out your stress and anger, this blog won’t release your anger and not your anger management class. If all fails I can direct you to the closest swinging club in your area, threesome, foursome, group orgy, anything that will help you get it out.
August 18th, 2006 at 3:01 pm
Osaid,
“Mr. Olmert will MAKE THE SKY FALL ON GAZA if they hurt the Israeli soldier.
Olmert’s mentality should bring him side by side near Sameer Qintar..”
How do you figure?
August 18th, 2006 at 5:44 pm
Ya Mohamed ya ibni aa’ib kedda
seebak men el hebaba dih aahna mosh naa’seen balawy 
August 19th, 2006 at 12:20 am
#305 anonon
Hmmm now that you put it that way, yeah, I agree, mostly. I am not sure of the full set of circumstances around Sabra and Shatila. What I do know of it is that the phlangists went on a killing spree. Unfortunately with the known tendency of the arab media to exagerate, embellish, and distort, there is really no way to get an unbiased and accurate picture of what really happened.
What I don’t know is if Sharon called the phlangists up and said “have at em’” while looking the other way, or if he is being pointed to as the high man on the totem pole when it happened, and the phlangists went off the reservation (and the deep end).
If Sharon did willfully condone murder, I would be saddened, and would imagine that he should have been tried for that. Based upon the long and sad biased history of the media and the arab media in particular, it is very probable that … extensions and embellishments … were added to a horrific crime in order to get the guy who had largely gutted the arab dream of tossing Israel into the sea.
Sadly this is more likely than Sharon sitting there with a pistol saying “lets roll”.
Sharon was an extremely effective military man. If he did commit war crimes, again, ignoring the arab press that thinks that any Israeli that draws a breath commits a war crime, he should have been punished.
You are right. There are zealots in every country and society. The trick is to keep them at bay, away from power, and far away from the weapons systems. A zealot is not sufficiently smart as to comprehend the potential consequences of their actions or adventurism. You are also right when you say they rot the cores of great peoples. There are many examples of this, current and past. The current ones can view what happened to the past ones to get an idea of their future.
March 24th, 2007 at 12:55 am
Check out my website on Samir Kuntar
August 22nd, 2007 at 10:20 pm
[...] wonderful site now rethink this recap http://www.sandmonkey.org/2006/08/13/on-samir-kuntar and give comments [...]
July 18th, 2008 at 12:03 am
[...] The story is retold by an Egyptian Blogger. You can read it here. [...]
July 19th, 2008 at 10:47 pm
What a hero Sam. Kunt. is. First he heroically defeats a small, unarmed Israeli child, then, when captured, bravely lies about it for years . Lebanon now throws him a party. This shows the world how great it is to be a muslim man. (Of course,If you are a muslim woman, you can be killed for any number of small offenses… dressing immodestly, etc…) But as a muslim man, you can kill children, and get a celebration! And he has been so faithful in denying it. Though many eyewitnesses saw him smash the little girls skull, he refuses to let reality interfere with his story. Such stamina!
Yes, a true hero that all of Lebanon can celebrate. I hope he can get work now that he has studied at university under those cruel Israeli jailors. Perhaps as a kindergarten teacher?
July 20th, 2008 at 8:14 pm
whoever supports those beasts are as monstrous as they. If G-d were to punish you all with the same, or worse, as that ghoul Kuntar did to his victims, I wouldn’t have even a moment of sympathy. And if it should begin to happen tomorrow, that wouldn’t be too soon!